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Author
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Topic: THE ROAD by Cormac McCarthy
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Dagny Dostoevsky, CBU/CFF
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posted
pick up the book...discussions shall begin Monday, October 9th...i'm not sure how many pages the book has, however, the book should be sectioned into 4 parts and the first of the four parts shall begin to be discussed on monday...
anyone who has the book and will be participating, please post the sections and the pages contained in each part...until then, just get to reading! ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
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Even the wisest among you is only a disharmony and hybrid of plant and phantom. But do I bid you become phantoms or plants?
Lo, I teach you the Superman!
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Sal Paradise
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posted
I'll probably get a chance to pic this up on thursday. Who else is in for this one?
If no one elses bites I might do Iceburg Slim. Havn't read that for at least ten years.
[ October 03, 2006, 12:44 PM: Message edited by: Sal Paradise ]
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when Charlie Parker was asked what religion do you follow? he replied " I am a very devout musician"
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Tiger*
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posted
How many pages in the book.. I want to grab this one and one other on the board.
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Keep the Womb Safe. Protect the Unborn
3 out of 5 African American women will abort their child.
http://blackgenocide.org/home.html
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Tiger*
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posted
cool.. then maybe I can do both.. thank you Mr Paradise..
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Keep the Womb Safe. Protect the Unborn
3 out of 5 African American women will abort their child.
http://blackgenocide.org/home.html
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Palatine William Wilson
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posted
I picked up book on Thursday..had to finish up other reading and will be ready to discuss on Monday...I've already read a few pages
whew!!!
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"You have conquered, and I yield. Yet, henceforward art thou also dead � dead to the World, to Heaven and to Hope! In me didst thou exist � and, in my death, see by this image, which is thine own, how utterly thou hast murdered thyself."
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Palatine William Wilson
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posted
I'm at page 70. The book could be divided up into 60 page segments. There are no chapters (yet) I will call this part the Set Up. So far the story is quite horrific
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"You have conquered, and I yield. Yet, henceforward art thou also dead � dead to the World, to Heaven and to Hope! In me didst thou exist � and, in my death, see by this image, which is thine own, how utterly thou hast murdered thyself."
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Sal Paradise
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quote:
Originally posted by William Wilson aka The Shadow:
I'm at page 70. The book could be divided up into 60 page segments. There are no chapters (yet) I will call this part the Set Up. So far the story is quite horrific
I'm at page 50. one sitting. I'll read up a bit before I post on it tommorow. At least catch up with you. At least he has punctuation. Many of his books do not.
yes
Setting
Post Apocylyptic America. Starkness to the umpth. Until tommorow.
[ October 09, 2006, 03:25 AM: Message edited by: Sal Paradise ]
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http://www.myspace.com/1sam2
http://thehydeout.blogspot.com/
when Charlie Parker was asked what religion do you follow? he replied " I am a very devout musician"
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Palatine William Wilson
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I can dig the one sitting vibe...this book is like picking a scab - you gotta look at the defilement beneath. The thing thats bugged is that there is a lot of love expressed between father and son.
My question ( which is hinted at); is the fathers love and devotion a self serving need to stay alive?
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"You have conquered, and I yield. Yet, henceforward art thou also dead � dead to the World, to Heaven and to Hope! In me didst thou exist � and, in my death, see by this image, which is thine own, how utterly thou hast murdered thyself."
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Sal Paradise
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quote:
Originally posted by William Wilson aka The Shadow:
I can dig the one sitting vibe...this book is like picking a scab - you gotta look at the defilement beneath. The thing thats bugged is that there is a lot of love expressed between father and son.
My question ( which is hinted at); is the fathers love and devotion a self serving need to stay alive?
That's at least where his Wife went with him before she ended it all.
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http://www.myspace.com/1sam2
http://thehydeout.blogspot.com/
when Charlie Parker was asked what religion do you follow? he replied " I am a very devout musician"
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Sal Paradise
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I think your right on with your question with regards to the Father needing his Son to justify existing. Do you think this is a moral questsion? Is that wrong for him to do?
It's all very mythic and broad. The characters don't even have names. What do you think of his imagined Anerican post Apocalypse? Seems like a pretty accurate meditation. I would say that he thinks this is the road that we are all ready on at present. Just furthr on down it in space and time. At least LOVE seems to be at the heart of this downer,
So little happens, mininal apocylypse. I felt the Blow when the Mom commits suicide. The kid having nothing to say when it happened kind of sais it all. Nothing left to say in a world that is nothing,
I also felt like my feet were getting frostbiten. All the trudging through bad weather.
If this book was 400 pages I don't think I could get through it. But I like his language, like listening to the best kind of camp fire tale. I had no problem getting into his setting. The world he has set his readers in I find convincing.
You think that marauding band in the Diesel truck would have canabalized the father and Son? Some definate Road Warrior in nuclear winter imagery going on through out.
reminds me of a high brow "The Stand" that Stephen King homage to the "Lord Of The Rings".
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http://www.myspace.com/1sam2
http://thehydeout.blogspot.com/
when Charlie Parker was asked what religion do you follow? he replied " I am a very devout musician"
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Palatine William Wilson
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The marauding band would definitely have eaten the father and son. After shooting the one of them they go back and find blood bones, skin and guts. And the bones look boiled!
This is most defintely a love story. the bond between father and son is deep. The use of the word PAPA stands as the only real nominative in the story so far. Also the sharing of the coca cola was such a deep expression of love.
I think the man is a survivor and his love for his son helps hime to keep going and to look for some hope in a dead world. In trying to do what it takes to survive he even finds life amidst death. his finding the morels, mushrooms is indicative of this. Mushrooms are usually a by-product of decay, yet here they are a source of life amidst death.
the one line that stands out for me so far that i struggle to understand is on p 27: "How does the never to be differ from what never was?" Any thoughts on this?
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"You have conquered, and I yield. Yet, henceforward art thou also dead � dead to the World, to Heaven and to Hope! In me didst thou exist � and, in my death, see by this image, which is thine own, how utterly thou hast murdered thyself."
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Sal Paradise
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quote:
Originally posted by William Wilson aka The Shadow:
The marauding band would definitely have eaten the father and son. After shooting the one of them they go back and find blood bones, skin and guts. And the bones look boiled!
This is most defintely a love story. the bond between father and son is deep. The use of the word PAPA stands as the only real nominative in the story so far. Also the sharing of the coca cola was such a deep expression of love.
I think the man is a survivor and his love for his son helps hime to keep going and to look for some hope in a dead world. In trying to do what it takes to survive he even finds life amidst death. his finding the morels, mushrooms is indicative of this. Mushrooms are usually a by-product of decay, yet here they are a source of life amidst death.
the one line that stands out for me so far that i struggle to understand is on p 27: "How does the never to be differ from what never was?" Any thoughts on this?
Nice. This is cool. Coca -Cola and mushroom scenes were both significant. Like your commentary, makes perfect sense to me.
on this conundrum. No light bulb going off so anything I speak on will be passing bullshit. The paragraph this passage comes out of goes
"On the Road there were no Godspoke men. They are gone and I am left and they have taken with them the world."
"Query. How does the never to be, differ from what never was."
the "never" may represent a longing. "the never to be" the future that will never happen. No heaven on Earth, the never being heaven. "What Never was", the Heaven on earth that has never existed. So how is the hope and imagined Utopia that will never exist any different than all of the past that always had that chance and never became such. Strip time away and it is all just never. We never had any chance but to wind up on this road, because we have never been anyting but this. (dead wood qoute) Miserable cocksuckers.
LOVE being the giant X factor. God's way out of the darkness he's left for all of us. Okay nuff B.S out of me.
[ October 09, 2006, 01:14 PM: Message edited by: Sal Paradise ]
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http://www.myspace.com/1sam2
http://thehydeout.blogspot.com/
when Charlie Parker was asked what religion do you follow? he replied " I am a very devout musician"
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Palatine William Wilson
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quote:
Originally posted by Sal Paradise:
quote:
Originally posted by William Wilson aka The Shadow:
The marauding band would definitely have eaten the father and son. After shooting the one of them they go back and find blood bones, skin and guts. And the bones look boiled!
This is most defintely a love story. the bond between father and son is deep. The use of the word PAPA stands as the only real nominative in the story so far. Also the sharing of the coca cola was such a deep expression of love.
I think the man is a survivor and his love for his son helps hime to keep going and to look for some hope in a dead world. In trying to do what it takes to survive he even finds life amidst death. his finding the morels, mushrooms is indicative of this. Mushrooms are usually a by-product of decay, yet here they are a source of life amidst death.
the one line that stands out for me so far that i struggle to understand is on p 27: "How does the never to be differ from what never was?" Any thoughts on this?
Nice. This is cool. Coca -Cola and mushroom scenes were both significant. Like your commentary, makes perfect sense to me.
on this conundrum. No light bulb going off so anything I speak on will be passing bullshit. The paragraph this passage comes out of goes
"On the Road there were no Godspoke men. They are gone and I am left and they have taken with them the world."
"Query. How does the never to be, differ from what never was."
the "never" may represent a longing. "the never to be" the future that will never happen. No heaven on Earth, the never being heaven. "What Never was", the Heaven on earth that has never existed. So how is the hope and imagined Utopia that will never exist any different than all of the past that always had that chance and never became such. Strip time away and it is all just never. We never had any chance but to wind up on this road, because we have never been anyting but this. (dead wood qoute) Miserable cocksuckers.
LOVE being the giant X factor. God's way out of the darkness he's left for all of us. Okay nuff B.S out of me.
I like that interpretation. there never has been utopia and now there never will be. .
Does that signal the end of hope?
Do you get the feeling he plans on killing the boy? He is saving that bullet
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"You have conquered, and I yield. Yet, henceforward art thou also dead � dead to the World, to Heaven and to Hope! In me didst thou exist � and, in my death, see by this image, which is thine own, how utterly thou hast murdered thyself."
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Palatine William Wilson
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Sal or 1sam2 or whomever
we have our differences...but you is right here. Have you ever read McCarthy before? He is not an easy read but very enjoyable.
Does his style ever make you have to re-read whole pages just to get his meaning due to an odd word flow?
or is it just me?
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"You have conquered, and I yield. Yet, henceforward art thou also dead � dead to the World, to Heaven and to Hope! In me didst thou exist � and, in my death, see by this image, which is thine own, how utterly thou hast murdered thyself."
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Sal Paradise
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I had to read the first forty pages of Blood Meridian two or maybe three times before it clicked. Meridian is with out any punctuation. But after a third time his rythm kind of clicked with my brain and I flew through the book after really struggling at the start.
I read his pretty horses trillogy. Blood Meridian and No Country
Left for Old Men.
I'm digging this to, thanks for the good conversation.
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http://thehydeout.blogspot.com/
when Charlie Parker was asked what religion do you follow? he replied " I am a very devout musician"
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Palatine William Wilson
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The pretty horses trilogy is next up. He is an amazing writer. I really am digging his work. I was starting a JG Ballard jag, but this put me on a new path.
The other aspect of this book was something i had talked about regarding emergency situations. Did you notice that the first think the man did after the nuclear strike (?) was to fill the tub with water? He suggests in this book that we are all going to have to be dependant on our selves and our wits to survive.
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"You have conquered, and I yield. Yet, henceforward art thou also dead � dead to the World, to Heaven and to Hope! In me didst thou exist � and, in my death, see by this image, which is thine own, how utterly thou hast murdered thyself."
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Sal Paradise
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I havn't abandoned this. Got a little caught up this last week with some extra shifts, plan on getting back into the book tonight. I figure I'll be finished in two or three more sittings. I'll have more to say come Monday.
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http://www.myspace.com/1sam2
http://thehydeout.blogspot.com/
when Charlie Parker was asked what religion do you follow? he replied " I am a very devout musician"
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Palatine William Wilson
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DAMMMMMMMM
These next 64 pages have been wild.
Cormac has a twisted and dark view of the depths of human deparavity. These pages are all about mans descent into darkness and barbarism in response to the cataclysm. He has depicted the strong turning on the weak and not helping them. This is in direct opposition to the man and his relationship with his son, whom he nurtures.
The polarity of what the man teaches his son is also wild. Obviously he shows his boy love, but he also teaches him to fear strangers and to look out for number one. The boy, however, in his innocence, shows a lot of compassion for others - that is shown by his wondering about the little boy and his wanting to help the people in the cellar.
This is so far one of the more horrific books I've ever read.
I also have a new vocabulary word to spring on those I joust with "catamite" - lol
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"You have conquered, and I yield. Yet, henceforward art thou also dead � dead to the World, to Heaven and to Hope! In me didst thou exist � and, in my death, see by this image, which is thine own, how utterly thou hast murdered thyself."
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Sal Paradise
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LOL. where did catamite get droped? The male sex pet.
Okay this reminded me of the enigma you poesed earlier. On pg 111. Especially the last sentance.
"he thought each memory recalled must do some violence to its origins. As in a party game. Say the word and pass it on. So be Sparing. what you alter in the remembering has yet a reality, known or not."
any thoughts?
It's funny this book really does bring up all the posts you have made regarding preparation for catasrtopohy.
I find myself slipping back and forth in point of view. Usually my mind is wrapped around the character of the man, but I find my self regressing at times to the P.O.V of the kid. It's easier not to be in control. I was releaved when they were starving that the Man didn't find them Human flesh. I found it funny that shortly after a scene was wrote out about the faher reassuring his son that they would never do that.
Have you come across the bunker yet?
that death camp was a wild scene.
[ October 24, 2006, 01:07 PM: Message edited by: Sal Paradise ]
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http://www.myspace.com/1sam2
http://thehydeout.blogspot.com/
when Charlie Parker was asked what religion do you follow? he replied " I am a very devout musician"
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Palatine William Wilson
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quote:
Originally posted by Sal Paradise:
LOL. where did catamite get droped? The male sex pet.
Okay this reminded me of the enigma you poesed earlier. On pg 111. Especially the last sentance.
"he thought each memory recalled must do some violence to its origins. As in a party game. Say the word and pass it on. So be Sparing. what you alter in the remembering has yet a reality, known or not."
any thoughts?
It's funny this book really does bring up all the posts you have made regarding preparation for catasrtopohy.
I find myself slipping back and forth in point of view. Usually my mind is wrapped around the character of the man, but I find my self regressing at times to the P.O.V of the kid. It's easier not to be in control. I was releaved when they were starving that the Man didn't find them Human flesh. I found it funny that shortly after a scene was wrote out about the faher reassuring his son that they would never do that.
Have you come across the bunker yet?
that death camp was a wild scene.
I too slip from father to son. And I feel that the son is a perfect counterbalance to the fathers cynicisn(?). The father is a survivor but I still dont see his reason for living. It seems he is living for the son but is preparing to kill the boy if he has to ( do u get that feeling?). He trusts noone and will help no other person.
On the other hand, the son's heart is still reaching out to other people. The son is still searching for the goodness in himself and others ( his constatnt askinng about "good guys' and "bad guys") He still wants to hhelp other people even though they might wish them harm. He has scene almost as much horror as his father, yet is still seeking the good in people.
The boy doesnt have the same knowledge of human nature pre - blast, so maybe thats why the father has to be sparing in how he relates the past (???)
Good question...i'll think on it
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"You have conquered, and I yield. Yet, henceforward art thou also dead � dead to the World, to Heaven and to Hope! In me didst thou exist � and, in my death, see by this image, which is thine own, how utterly thou hast murdered thyself."
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Sal Paradise
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though your spot on, your commentary on the man cracks me up. I mean he did live through and is now living in the post apocalypse. He has to avoid maurading canables on the road, this might make me selfish and self centered as well.
But you are on to something. The kids humanity that exists in spite of it all has to be the most relevant thing in the story. I thought before they found the bunker that maybe you were right about that last bullet. Now I' not so sure. Why wouldn't he just do it already?
the west is often a metaphor for death in America (even though the suns sets in the east) You go to the countries edge before you go out and beyond it. So one way or the other I think your on to something. This book is about dying not living. I doubt they will find a better kind of life where it is warm.
Have you encountered the old man on the road yet? A wise man would deduct something from this encounter. I am not feeling so wise this week.
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http://www.myspace.com/1sam2
http://thehydeout.blogspot.com/
when Charlie Parker was asked what religion do you follow? he replied " I am a very devout musician"
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Palatine William Wilson
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quote:
Originally posted by Sal Paradise:
though your spot on, your commentary on the man cracks me up. I mean he did live through and is now living in the post apocalypse. He has to avoid maurading canables on the road, this might make me selfish and self centered as well.
But you are on to something. The kids humanity that exists in spite of it all has to be the most relevant thing in the story. I thought before they found the bunker that maybe you were right about that last bullet. Now I' not so sure. Why wouldn't he just do it already?
the west is often a metaphor for death in America (even though the suns sets in the east) You go to the countries edge before you go out and beyond it. So one way or the other I think your on to something. This book is about dying not living. I doubt they will find a better kind of life where it is warm.
Have you encountered the old man on the road yet? A wise man would deduct something from this encounter. I am not feeling so wise this week.
Sal...I'll have more thoughts this week...sorry to have slowed down the convo
The old man on the road is a wild seen..I aint that wise either..but its funny, cuz he did end up gaining (lol)
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"You have conquered, and I yield. Yet, henceforward art thou also dead � dead to the World, to Heaven and to Hope! In me didst thou exist � and, in my death, see by this image, which is thine own, how utterly thou hast murdered thyself."
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Sal Paradise
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It's all good in My Boook William. We have sinced each others and coincedentaly shared reading habits on this. I am one sitting away from finished. I've been shooting a short film all week and doubling up with my weekly gigs at night, so My time has been crazy. I am wrapping this film up TODAY. So will have time to knock this out some time this week.
So far so good though. Our discussion has been a great suplament to my reading this book so far.
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http://www.myspace.com/1sam2
http://thehydeout.blogspot.com/
when Charlie Parker was asked what religion do you follow? he replied " I am a very devout musician"
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