I support the troops [Archive] - Deep House Page Forums

The Buddy Love Show

04-09-2003, 11:11 AM

Originally posted by konbit:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Albert D.:
I have family in the military so yes I do support them. graemlins/thumbsup.gif I might not support the war or the policy that the US government has with other nations, but I do support our troops...ALWAYS! Without them, neither you nor I would be able to enjoy the freedom we have in this country such as being able to communicate and voice your opinion in a public forum such as the internet.

GI Jane signing off! smokin.gif How quick people are to spout off tired cliches. Just out of curiosity...can you please tell me when the last time American troops protected the freedoms you list above? I would like a concrete example please.

Other catch phrases I hate:

"Hero"-You're not a hero unles you commit a heroic act. Simply joining the Armed Forces and doing what they tell you is not heroic.

"Weapons of Mass Destruction": a catch phrase used to inspire fear.; Please list examples of weapons that have caused "mass destruction," and who used them where and when.

"terror"/"terrorism": Anybody with half a brain should be disgusted with the misappropriations of this idea. [/QUOTE]damn konbit...moving in with the heavy artillery huh

made me think!

as for protectors of american freedoms..that job is performed by the police, courts, justice department and fbi..and rather dubiously i might add - but NOT the military

sorry for kibbitzing

GROOVE VICTIM

04-09-2003, 11:20 AM

So what do some of you who feel this way to the troops when they come home?

The Donger

04-09-2003, 11:22 AM

It would be funny to see soldiers spit in U.S. civilians faces when they got home for a change.

The Buddy Love Show

04-09-2003, 11:24 AM

Originally posted by Ghost Of Donger:
It would be funny to see soldiers spit in U.S. civilians faces when they got home for a change. actually it wouldn't..they aint heavily armed at that point and might just get they ass kicked if they step to the wrong mo

The Donger

04-09-2003, 11:31 AM

Originally posted by your idol, Buddy Love:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Ghost Of Donger:
It would be funny to see soldiers spit in U.S. civilians faces when they got home for a change. actually it wouldn't..they aint heavily armed at that point and might just get they ass kicked if they step to the wrong mo [/QUOTE]Wow, they must be pretty tough.

Let me know if you ever meet someone like that.

Chris Conrad

04-09-2003, 11:34 AM

by the way, its interesting to note that quite a few in the military do oppose the war...but you don't hear about it...an army colonel friend of my father's, in a recent conversation with him called the us 'barbarians', and expressed interest in leaving the country after his time in the military. several other military friends of his expressed similar views. a high ranking military customer of mine that i dealt with at my job also expressed a similar view before he made his last purchase with me before leaving...adding that there are deep reasons for all this that many people would not understand or be able to deal with.

The Buddy Love Show

04-09-2003, 11:37 AM

Originally posted by Ghost Of Donger:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by your idol, Buddy Love:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Ghost Of Donger:
It would be funny to see soldiers spit in U.S. civilians faces when they got home for a change. actually it wouldn't..they aint heavily armed at that point and might just get they ass kicked if they step to the wrong mo [/QUOTE]Wow, they must be pretty tough.

Let me know if you ever meet someone like that. [/QUOTE]aww..pussy ass mofos always are impressed by uniforms...take away the guns and badges and what do ya have left...2 mother****ers..unarmed...but i can see how punks get intimidated - they look soo tough and manly , heh?

The Donger

04-09-2003, 11:38 AM

Originally posted by christopher conrad:
by the way, its interesting to note that quite a few in the military do oppose the war...but you don't hear about it...You hear plenty about it. The closest advisors to Bush have been split on this matter. I hear plent of anti-war stuff all the time.

GROOVE VICTIM

04-09-2003, 11:39 AM

http://www.fatherryan.org/blackmilitary/james.jpg

Daniel "Chappie" James, Jr.

Can you support a role model atleast?

http://www.kent.k12.wa.us/KSD/SJ/TuskegeeAirmen/McDaniels.JPG

The Donger

04-09-2003, 11:39 AM

Originally posted by your idol, Buddy Love:
- they look soo tough and manly , heh? I wouldn't know, you are the one carrying around the lube.

Chris Conrad

04-09-2003, 11:45 AM

Originally posted by your idol, Buddy Love:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Ghost Of Donger:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by your idol, Buddy Love:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Ghost Of Donger:
It would be funny to see soldiers spit in U.S. civilians faces when they got home for a change. actually it wouldn't..they aint heavily armed at that point and might just get they ass kicked if they step to the wrong mo [/QUOTE]Wow, they must be pretty tough.

Let me know if you ever meet someone like that. [/QUOTE]aww..pussy ass mofos always are impressed by uniforms...take away the guns and badges and what do ya have left...2 mother****ers..unarmed...but i can see how punks get intimidated - they look soo tough and manly , heh? [/QUOTE]by the way, back in the early/mid nineties i was employed at UPS as a supervisor, at one of their major hub facilities where trucks were loaded and unloaded. at one point in time, many gulf war veterans came to work there after their time in the military was done. it was during the summer, and temperatures in the trailers often reached over 100 degrees. when asked if the can handle it, most said, sure we can, we were blowing away iraqi's in the desert for months, we can loadd a damn truck. all but one quit before the 6 week evaluation period was over, usually saying, 'i can't take this sh*t any more', you all are crazy!!!'. the one that stayed on actually lasted a year or two before being fired for being a repeat problem (fighting and racist comments). almost all the gulf war veterans i knew there also were in serious debt.

a friend of mine who recently lfet the marines, just missing the 'war' with iraq expressed to me how happy he was to get out, sayign they promise you an education, the world, but all i came back with was a ton of credit cards, debt out my ass, a pregnant girl friend and i can't get a job.

The Buddy Love Show

04-09-2003, 11:45 AM

Originally posted by Ghost Of Donger:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by your idol, Buddy Love:
- they look soo tough and manly , heh? I wouldn't know, you are the one carrying around the lube. [/QUOTE]aww son...reading is fundamental...the statement was that i'd dispense with the lube not dispense it...that in no way implies that i'm carrying it ( besides i leave that to my bitches) keep up baby boy i know its hard but be like the lil train that could...

damn, cats wanna ACT like they can read and **** it all up

[ April 09, 2003, 12:47 PM: Message edited by: your idol, Buddy Love ]

mhd

04-09-2003, 11:46 AM

be all you can be

The Buddy Love Show

04-09-2003, 11:46 AM

so nice i tried to say it twice

[ April 09, 2003, 12:48 PM: Message edited by: your idol, Buddy Love ]

GROOVE VICTIM

04-09-2003, 11:48 AM

Originally posted by christopher conrad:

a friend of mine who recently lfet the marines, just missing the 'war' with iraq expressed to me how happy he was to get out, sayign they promise you an education, the world, but all i came back with was a ton of credit cards, debt out my ass, a pregnant girl friend and i can't get a job. And he blamed this on the military?

My brother who's been in the army for 18 years and is out there in Iraq as we speak, got his degree, a beautiful home, a beautiful wife, and a beautiful son, making damn near 50 grand a year, two beautiful cars and is a shoe in for any job if he decides to retire in 2005.

Go figure.

Peace

mhd

04-09-2003, 11:52 AM

50 grand a year after 18 years!! for risking your life!!! slavery had to be more lucrative

The Buddy Love Show

04-09-2003, 11:54 AM

Originally posted by GROOVE VICTIM:
http://www.fatherryan.org/blackmilitary/james.jpg

Daniel "Chappie" James, Jr.

Can you support a role model atleast?

http://www.kent.k12.wa.us/KSD/SJ/TuskegeeAirmen/McDaniels.JPG even role models can talk to hanes if they wanna keep they nuts in check

Chris Conrad

04-09-2003, 11:55 AM

Originally posted by GROOVE VICTIM:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by christopher conrad:

a friend of mine who recently lfet the marines, just missing the 'war' with iraq expressed to me how happy he was to get out, sayign they promise you an education, the world, but all i came back with was a ton of credit cards, debt out my ass, a pregnant girl friend and i can't get a job. And he blamed this on the military?

My brother who's been in the army for 18 years and is out there in Iraq as we speak, got his degree, a beautiful home, a beautiful wife, and a beautiful son, making damn near 50 grand a year, two beautiful cars and is a shoe in for any job if he decides to retire in 2005.

Go figure.

Peace [/QUOTE]then he utilized what can be utilized by joining the military....but from the people who used to work for me, friends and high school buddies who joined, most of them did jack with it...

The Donger

04-09-2003, 11:55 AM

2 edits and still no laughs.

Koffy Brown

04-09-2003, 11:59 AM

Originally posted by christopher conrad:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by GROOVE VICTIM:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by christopher conrad:

a friend of mine who recently lfet the marines, just missing the 'war' with iraq expressed to me how happy he was to get out, sayign they promise you an education, the world, but all i came back with was a ton of credit cards, debt out my ass, a pregnant girl friend and i can't get a job. And he blamed this on the military?

My brother who's been in the army for 18 years and is out there in Iraq as we speak, got his degree, a beautiful home, a beautiful wife, and a beautiful son, making damn near 50 grand a year, two beautiful cars and is a shoe in for any job if he decides to retire in 2005.

Go figure.

Peace [/QUOTE]then he utilized what can be utilized by joining the military....but from the people who used to work for me, friends and high school buddies who joined, most of them did jack with it... [/QUOTE]I have to agree with Christopher Conrad on this one..I was in for a huge awakening, I thought jobs would be so easily available for me being that I had just gotten out of the Marine Corps, I was young, gung ho and naive...the USA is not as welcoming to vets as they claim to be...and it also has alot to do with the job you have while in the military...when are the guys in infantry going to have time to get a college degree? Most of the time even when there isn't a war they are deployed...it's not what it's built up to be..

[ April 09, 2003, 01:00 PM: Message edited by: Ashaki ]

LEONARD REMIX RROY

04-09-2003, 12:09 PM

If The Shoe Fit wear it! You bunch of F--king Cowards. Spouting off all of this bull when we have members that are over-there & in battle.

How soon we forget huh, you lame ass pussies (for the lack of a better word).

This is not directed at all who posted on this thread but - If This Shoe Fits - YOU SUCK!!!!

JoeB

04-09-2003, 12:10 PM

Originally posted by Ashaki:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by christopher conrad:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by GROOVE VICTIM:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by christopher conrad:

a friend of mine who recently lfet the marines, just missing the 'war' with iraq expressed to me how happy he was to get out, sayign they promise you an education, the world, but all i came back with was a ton of credit cards, debt out my ass, a pregnant girl friend and i can't get a job. And he blamed this on the military?

My brother who's been in the army for 18 years and is out there in Iraq as we speak, got his degree, a beautiful home, a beautiful wife, and a beautiful son, making damn near 50 grand a year, two beautiful cars and is a shoe in for any job if he decides to retire in 2005.

Go figure.

Peace [/QUOTE]then he utilized what can be utilized by joining the military....but from the people who used to work for me, friends and high school buddies who joined, most of them did jack with it... [/QUOTE]I have to agree with Christopher Conrad on this one..I was in for a huge awakening, I thought jobs would be so easily available for me being that I had just gotten out of the Marine Corps, I was young, gung ho and naive...the USA is not as welcoming to vets as they claim to be...and it also has alot to do with the job you have while in the military...when are the guys in infantry going to have time to get a college degree? Most of the time even when there isn't a war they are deployed...it's not what it's built up to be.. [/QUOTE]that's funny. i had the opposite reaction.

and a lot of my friends who were grunts went on to work for customs, border patrol, state police, etc, etc while some of my boys that went to college didn't make it in to said organizations because i guess they gave ppreferential treatment to vets, which is o.k. in my book.

i guess it could possibly depend on the individual is what i'm trying to get at.

GROOVE VICTIM

04-09-2003, 12:11 PM

Originally posted by christopher conrad:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by GROOVE VICTIM:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by christopher conrad:

a friend of mine who recently lfet the marines, just missing the 'war' with iraq expressed to me how happy he was to get out, sayign they promise you an education, the world, but all i came back with was a ton of credit cards, debt out my ass, a pregnant girl friend and i can't get a job. And he blamed this on the military?

My brother who's been in the army for 18 years and is out there in Iraq as we speak, got his degree, a beautiful home, a beautiful wife, and a beautiful son, making damn near 50 grand a year, two beautiful cars and is a shoe in for any job if he decides to retire in 2005.

Go figure.

Peace [/QUOTE]then he utilized what can be utilized by joining the military....but from the people who used to work for me, friends and high school buddies who joined, most of them did jack with it... [/QUOTE]Exactly, you don't go in the military expecting everything to fall for you with ease. You have to work your ass off to get where you want to go. Anyone who thinks that they can ass kiss their way up the ranks is a straight up fool.

When commanding officers see ass kissers, they will try their best to run their asses out of the military.

These are the ones complaining why they're stuck cleaning toilet bowls and the were in the military for more than 5 years.

Leslie

04-09-2003, 12:12 PM

Originally posted by mhd:
50 grand a year after 18 years!! for risking your life!!! slavery had to be more lucrative I have to agree. Most military families are not doing well at all. The amount of money they make is minimal and often times not enough to support their families on, esp. with young kids and wives that do not work - which is usually the case. I saw loads of that while away at school. As for the debt, its ridiculous how much debt these soldiers get themselves into when they get out of basic and get assigned - the first thing they do is run out and buy a car because the dealers in military base areas make the prices so attractive and half of them can't even make the payments and pay the bills because they make so little. No money down - the military does not do a good job at all of being truthful about the amnount of moeny they will be making and teaching these kids (cause that's what they are) how to be responsible for their money and spending it wisely.

Chris Conrad

04-09-2003, 12:13 PM

if this country were being directly invaded, with an invasion force at our shores and invasion planes in our skies, i would most certainly defend myself and this country...but where's the invasion? so far its from within...

Koffy Brown

04-09-2003, 12:16 PM

commanding officers love ass kissers...it's those that won't allow themselves to be treated like dog shit that catch hell...

it could be an individual thing or maybe even a demographic thing...but it's not until now especially with the war they see military on your resume and you become a hot commodity...jmo

GROOVE VICTIM

04-09-2003, 12:16 PM

GROOVE VICTIM

04-09-2003, 12:19 PM

Originally posted by Ashaki:
commanding officers love ass kissers...it's those that won't allow themselves to be treated like dog shit that catch hell...

it could be an individual thing or maybe even a demographic thing...but it's not until now especially with the war they see military on your resume and you become a hot commodity...jmo Remember that most ass kissers do it for personal gain. Don't expect one of these to be in charge of an entire platoon.

You were in the military, you know the code.

Peace

Leslie

04-09-2003, 12:29 PM

Originally posted by GROOVE VICTIM:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Leslie:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by mhd:
50 grand a year after 18 years!! for risking your life!!! slavery had to be more lucrative I have to agree. Most military families are not doing well at all. The amount of money they make is minimal and often times not enough to support their families on, esp. with young kids and wives that do not work - which is usually the case. I saw loads of that while away at school. As for the debt, its ridiculous how much debt these soldiers get themselves into when they get out of basic and get assigned - the first thing they do is run out and buy a car because the dealers in military base areas make the prices so attractive and half of them can't even make the payments and pay the bills because they make so little. No money down - the military does not do a good job at all of being truthful about the amnount of moeny they will be making and teaching these kids (cause that's what they are) how to be responsible for their money and spending it wisely. [/QUOTE]This is true, and maybe my brother and his wife (former marine, college educated and practicing nurse) are the exceptions to the rule, but I have yet to hear about them complaining about bills and not having money or not being happy with the exception to the fact that he hasn't been home due to being stationed overseas.

Peace [/QUOTE]I'd venture to say they are an exception also - the fact that she works in a professional field makes a major difference. I never understood why so many military families were so keen on having all these kids right away and the wives not work. Somehow I feel there is an illusion that you make enough money to support your family when you are in the military and that is just not entirely true for the rank and file.

Koffy Brown

04-09-2003, 12:35 PM

Originally posted by Leslie:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by GROOVE VICTIM:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Leslie:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by mhd:
50 grand a year after 18 years!! for risking your life!!! slavery had to be more lucrative I have to agree. Most military families are not doing well at all. The amount of money they make is minimal and often times not enough to support their families on, esp. with young kids and wives that do not work - which is usually the case. I saw loads of that while away at school. As for the debt, its ridiculous how much debt these soldiers get themselves into when they get out of basic and get assigned - the first thing they do is run out and buy a car because the dealers in military base areas make the prices so attractive and half of them can't even make the payments and pay the bills because they make so little. No money down - the military does not do a good job at all of being truthful about the amnount of moeny they will be making and teaching these kids (cause that's what they are) how to be responsible for their money and spending it wisely. [/QUOTE]This is true, and maybe my brother and his wife (former marine, college educated and practicing nurse) are the exceptions to the rule, but I have yet to hear about them complaining about bills and not having money or not being happy with the exception to the fact that he hasn't been home due to being stationed overseas.

Peace [/QUOTE]I'd venture to say they are an exception also - the fact that she works in a professional field makes a major difference. I never understood why so many military families were so keen on having all these kids right away and the wives not work. Somehow I feel there is an illusion that you make enough money to support your family when you are in the military and that is just not entirely true for the rank and file. [/QUOTE]maybe the illusion is FREE HOUSING, FREE MEDICAL, LIVING EXPENSE, TRAVEL THE WORLD, BONUS..blah blah blah...when actually nothing is free...your right it's all an illusion

GROOVE VICTIM

04-09-2003, 12:35 PM

One thing that I have noticed especially down here at Ft Stewart and Ft Benning aren't really "Military" towns.

What I mean by that is the fact that when my brother was part of the 82nd airborne stationed at Ft. Bragg, N.C., the base was engulfed by Fayetteville, N.C. A city within a city. If you played your cards right, your spouse can land a very good job. This is somewhat similar at Ft. Campbell, Kentucky, home of teh 101st.

This isn't really the case here at Stewart and Benning. To land a decent job you would have to consider travelling to Atlanta (about an hour north of Ft Benning) or to Savannah (about 30 minutes east of Ft Stewart).

So you really can't sit around and wait for your bills to get paid in these (doughnuts).

Peace

LEONARD REMIX RROY

04-09-2003, 12:49 PM

Originally posted by Leslie:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by mhd:
50 grand a year after 18 years!! for risking your life!!! slavery had to be more lucrative I have to agree. Most military families are not doing well at all. The amount of money they make is minimal and often times not enough to support their families on, esp. with young kids and wives that do not work - which is usually the case. I saw loads of that while away at school. As for the debt, its ridiculous how much debt these soldiers get themselves into when they get out of basic and get assigned - the first thing they do is run out and buy a car because the dealers in military base areas make the prices so attractive and half of them can't even make the payments and pay the bills because they make so little. No money down - the military does not do a good job at all of being truthful about the amnount of moeny they will be making and teaching these kids (cause that's what they are) how to be responsible for their money and spending it wisely. [/QUOTE]We are not babysitters #1, but I will say:
A good NCO (Like Myself) give new soldiers guidance and if they screw up after that, it's all on them.

As for the lack of money: (due to the increase in taxes) a person who earned $5.50 an hour and worked 8 hours overtime in 1993 earned the same amount (Net Pay) that a person who earns $9.50 an hour now with no over time in a pay period (I am talking single with no dependant status)

If a military family is hurting, it is fault of the adults and not the military. A married soldier has a few bills, Food, Phone, Cable, Car Note, Insurance. Loose the new car and go used & paid for which cut your yearly insurance bill 60% or more, Loose the Cable and rent video tapes from Block Buster.

The problem with some people have is, they wanna look 50K on a 20K salary and end up in debt out the ass.

My child support, car insurance and other (standard rate bills) are paid yearly and not monthly.

It is easy to get bills straight via payroll deduction (military allotments)

GROOVE VICTIM

04-09-2003, 12:53 PM

Thank you, and this is also why when you go overseas, you buy all your good shit there, not here in the US.

One thing that I respected my two brothers for was not going out and immediatly buying a new car and getting it pimped out. You pay your dues and work your way up.

Learn the tricks of the trade, and you will make a good living.

LEONARD REMIX RROY

04-09-2003, 12:57 PM

Originally posted by GROOVE VICTIM:
One thing that I have noticed especially down here at Ft Stewart and Ft Benning aren't really "Military" towns.

What I mean by that is the fact that when my brother was part of the 82nd airborne stationed at Ft. Bragg, N.C., the base was engulfed by Fayetteville, N.C. A city within a city. If you played your cards right, your spouse can land a very good job. This is somewhat similar at Ft. Campbell, Kentucky, home of teh 101st.

This isn't really the case here at Stewart and Benning. To land a decent job you would have to consider travelling to Atlanta (about an hour north of Ft Benning) or to Savannah (about 30 minutes east of Ft Stewart).

So you really can't sit around and wait for your bills to get paid in these (doughnuts).

Peace I remember Ft. McPherson (Atlanta) you are stationed in a major city and a spouse has plenty of chances to land a job.

Now places like Ft. Leonard Wood, MO. You're 2.5 hours away from St. Louis, unlike Ft. Sam Houston which is in San Antiono which I hear is a good place for employment.

Koffy Brown

04-09-2003, 12:58 PM

Originally posted by GROOVE VICTIM:
Thank you, and this is also why when you go overseas, you buy all your good shit there, not here in the US.

One thing that I respected my two brothers for was not going out and immediatly buying a new car and getting it pimped out. You pay your dues and work your way up.

Learn the tricks of the trade, and you will make a good living.

[ April 09, 2003, 02:02 PM: Message edited by: Ashaki ]

GROOVE VICTIM

04-09-2003, 01:04 PM

Well Ashaki I saw your response before you deleted it and all I have to say is "Life is what you make it".

Peace

LEONARD REMIX RROY

04-09-2003, 01:14 PM

If I were active duty I would (at my current rank) earn 32K a year.

I examine that compaired to the bills I pay now that I would not have being on active duty. I could X off Gas, Light, Rent and I would also save on fuel due to a short drive to work.

All the money spent there could be going into an IRA or better yet, I could get schooled on investments via Member MHD.

Long as people have poor budget skills they will always be behind the 8 Ball as of their bills and living check to check.

JoeB

04-09-2003, 01:40 PM

Originally posted by Leslie:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by GROOVE VICTIM:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Leslie:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by mhd:
50 grand a year after 18 years!! for risking your life!!! slavery had to be more lucrative I have to agree. Most military families are not doing well at all. The amount of money they make is minimal and often times not enough to support their families on, esp. with young kids and wives that do not work - which is usually the case. I saw loads of that while away at school. As for the debt, its ridiculous how much debt these soldiers get themselves into when they get out of basic and get assigned - the first thing they do is run out and buy a car because the dealers in military base areas make the prices so attractive and half of them can't even make the payments and pay the bills because they make so little. No money down - the military does not do a good job at all of being truthful about the amnount of moeny they will be making and teaching these kids (cause that's what they are) how to be responsible for their money and spending it wisely. [/QUOTE]This is true, and maybe my brother and his wife (former marine, college educated and practicing nurse) are the exceptions to the rule, but I have yet to hear about them complaining about bills and not having money or not being happy with the exception to the fact that he hasn't been home due to being stationed overseas.

Peace [/QUOTE]I'd venture to say they are an exception also - the fact that she works in a professional field makes a major difference. I never understood why so many military families were so keen on having all these kids right away and the wives not work. Somehow I feel there is an illusion that you make enough money to support your family when you are in the military and that is just not entirely true for the rank and file. [/QUOTE]talk about a huge generalization. leslie, how can you say that this is an exception? what makes you so sure of this? i'm just wondering. true, you do see these kinda people but to make them appear as the norm is something i HAVE to disagree with being a former service member myself.

The Donger

04-09-2003, 01:47 PM

Thanks Joe B, as I didn't want to speak on your behalf.

I have love for our troops!

imported_Gman

04-09-2003, 01:48 PM

Originally posted by LEONARD REMIX RROY:
If The Shoe Fit wear it! You bunch of F--king Cowards. Spouting off all of this bull when we have members that are over-there & in battle.

How soon we forget huh, you lame ass pussies (for the lack of a better word).

This is not directed at all who posted on this thread but - If This Shoe Fits - YOU SUCK!!!! Come on now Leonard, first warning.

-G

Leslie

04-09-2003, 02:00 PM

Originally posted by JoeB:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Leslie:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by GROOVE VICTIM:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Leslie:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by mhd:
50 grand a year after 18 years!! for risking your life!!! slavery had to be more lucrative I have to agree. Most military families are not doing well at all. The amount of money they make is minimal and often times not enough to support their families on, esp. with young kids and wives that do not work - which is usually the case. I saw loads of that while away at school. As for the debt, its ridiculous how much debt these soldiers get themselves into when they get out of basic and get assigned - the first thing they do is run out and buy a car because the dealers in military base areas make the prices so attractive and half of them can't even make the payments and pay the bills because they make so little. No money down - the military does not do a good job at all of being truthful about the amnount of moeny they will be making and teaching these kids (cause that's what they are) how to be responsible for their money and spending it wisely. [/QUOTE]This is true, and maybe my brother and his wife (former marine, college educated and practicing nurse) are the exceptions to the rule, but I have yet to hear about them complaining about bills and not having money or not being happy with the exception to the fact that he hasn't been home due to being stationed overseas.

Peace [/QUOTE]I'd venture to say they are an exception also - the fact that she works in a professional field makes a major difference. I never understood why so many military families were so keen on having all these kids right away and the wives not work. Somehow I feel there is an illusion that you make enough money to support your family when you are in the military and that is just not entirely true for the rank and file. [/QUOTE]talk about a huge generalization. leslie, how can you say that this is an exception? what makes you so sure of this? i'm just wondering. true, you do see these kinda people but to make them appear as the norm is something i HAVE to disagree with being a former service member myself. [/QUOTE]Okay.

konbit

04-09-2003, 02:03 PM

Originally posted by GROOVE VICTIM:
So what do some of you who feel this way to the troops when they come home? I don't think that anybody should have any ill will for the troops. I think that we should commend those that do their job well, and be willing to criticize those that don't...just like people in any other public profession.

I really hate this "we have to support our troops" blanket statements, though. It's just as dumb as "books not bombs" and "impeach Bush" slogans. These catch phrases are used to keep people from having to actually think about what they are talking about. They just spit jargon and cliches instead of forming educated opinions. "Suppot Our Troops" just sounds like the reciting of nationalistic propoganda to me. And when people start using language like "fighting for our freedoms"...I fear that the populace has lost the ability to think beyond their high school cheering squad.

Language is a tool that can strongly influence people, and the right wing has long been very adept at twisting it to their advantage in order to sway public opinion (i.e. "pro-LIFE," "Death Tax," Collateral Damage") The left does it too, obviously, but to a less successful effect.

djmarbll

04-09-2003, 02:06 PM

Originally posted by LEONARD REMIX RROY:
Long as people have poor budget skills they will always be behind the 8 Ball as of their bills and living check to check. [/QB]Great point Leonard. O know people who eran 50k and more and you'd never tell because they're always in debt. People often make the mistake of judging someone's income based on what they get before the bills are paid. If I make 100K a year, but my expenses are 99k a year, my take home is only $1000. Say I 30k a year but my expenses are 15k a year. I take home 15k. Many people try to live above their means, but there is a way to do it and still be responsible. I'm sick of seeing brothas with SUV's with rims, but they still live with their momma. I'm sick of seeing kids with X-Boxes and no pc's. I'm sick of seeing people with a nice car, closet full of clothes, tv's, dvd players, cable, computers, and no investments. Thta's not how you win in the game of life.

GROOVE VICTIM

04-09-2003, 02:08 PM

The way I see it, it's no different than a close relative getting a job as a grocery clerk, knowing damn well he or she can land a job as an executive at a corporation or something.

No matter the risk or the BS, support the fact that they just want to be happy and live their lives the way they want to, not how we want their lives to be.

Peace

mhd

04-09-2003, 02:10 PM

Originally posted by LEONARD REMIX RROY:
If I were active duty I would (at my current rank) earn 32K a year.

I examine that compaired to the bills I pay now that I would not have being on active duty. I could X off Gas, Light, Rent and I would also save on fuel due to a short drive to work.

All the money spent there could be going into an IRA or better yet, I could get schooled on investments via Member MHD.

Long as people have poor budget skills they will always be behind the 8 Ball as of their bills and living check to check. good point, no matter how much you make if you don't handle it properly you will be in trouble.

mhd

04-09-2003, 02:13 PM

LEONARD REMIX RROY

04-09-2003, 02:17 PM

Originally posted by djmarbll:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by LEONARD REMIX RROY:
Long as people have poor budget skills they will always be behind the 8 Ball as of their bills and living check to check. Great point Leonard. O know people who eran 50k and more and you'd never tell because they're always in debt. People often make the mistake of judging someone's income based on what they get before the bills are paid. If I make 100K a year, but my expenses are 99k a year, my take home is only $1000. Say I 30k a year but my expenses are 15k a year. I take home 15k. Many people try to live above their means, but there is a way to do it and still be responsible. I'm sick of seeing brothas with SUV's with rims, but they still live with their momma. I'm sick of seeing kids with X-Boxes and no pc's. I'm sick of seeing people with a nice car, closet full of clothes, tv's, dvd players, cable, computers, and no investments. Thta's not how you win in the game of life. [/QB][/QUOTE]It was once said, If a person owe more that they make in a years pay, technically they are bankrupt.

A lot of people do not look at Net Worth IE: the value of what they own free & clear. Other than Phone, Utilities & food I really don't have any bills. Everything-else I own is paid for.

mhd

04-09-2003, 02:23 PM

the high participation of brothers in the military is a reflection of poor high schools, lack of financial aid for college and lack of job opportunities. true or false

konbit

04-09-2003, 02:28 PM

Check this weeks Newsweek for the racial percentages in the military. Be sure to check the part that shows the racial make up officers compared to enlisted...

Originally posted by mhd:
the high participation of brothers in the military is a reflection of poor high schools, lack of financial aid for college and lack of job opportunities. true or false

LEONARD REMIX RROY

04-09-2003, 02:29 PM

PS 2, X Box, DVD and no PC? that's foul because the PC save you money on games & DVD if you know how to dub them. Rent from Block Buster and get your dub on for all of the above.

What are the good games going for now days? If a person Dub little as 20 of their favorite games...that pretty much off set the price paid for the PC and it increase their net worth.

Oak Pk, IL's Best Bedroom DJ, serge

04-09-2003, 02:33 PM

Originally posted by mhd:
the high participation of brothers in the military is a reflection of poor high schools, lack of financial aid for college and lack of job opportunities. true or false true. true. and true.

the patriot act has a provision buried in it's pages that requires high schools to provide the names of all their students to armed forces recruiters. i know quite a latino & black kids who are getting hit up heavily by these recruiters. they especially like to target low-income neighborhoods and rural areas, and not the suburbs.

LEONARD REMIX RROY

04-09-2003, 02:35 PM

Originally posted by mhd:
the high participation of brothers in the military is a reflection of poor high schools, lack of financial aid for college and lack of job opportunities. true or false We take up 25% of the military (only 10% of Combat Arms Jobs) as for the Officer & Enlisted thing - there are more Black Women in college than Black Men in the civilian world - with that in mind I can only assume that there are more Black Women Officers in the military than Black Men.

LEONARD REMIX RROY

04-09-2003, 02:46 PM

Originally posted by serge:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by mhd:
the high participation of brothers in the military is a reflection of poor high schools, lack of financial aid for college and lack of job opportunities. true or false true. true. and true.

the patriot act has a provision buried in it's pages that requires high schools to provide the names of all their students to armed forces recruiters. i know quite a latino & black kids who are getting hit up heavily by these recruiters. they especially like to target low-income neighborhoods and rural areas, and not the suburbs. [/QUOTE]Before all this war stuff started I used to talk with Black youth about joining the military and I would get dumb answers like "what i'm gonna join the Army for when i'm at war in the hood"

IDIOTS!!!!!!!!!!!!

JoeB

04-09-2003, 02:59 PM

Originally posted by mhd:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by JoeB:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Leslie:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by GROOVE VICTIM:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Leslie:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by mhd:
50 grand a year after 18 years!! for risking your life!!! slavery had to be more lucrative I have to agree. Most military families are not doing well at all. The amount of money they make is minimal and often times not enough to support their families on, esp. with young kids and wives that do not work - which is usually the case. I saw loads of that while away at school. As for the debt, its ridiculous how much debt these soldiers get themselves into when they get out of basic and get assigned - the first thing they do is run out and buy a car because the dealers in military base areas make the prices so attractive and half of them can't even make the payments and pay the bills because they make so little. No money down - the military does not do a good job at all of being truthful about the amnount of moeny they will be making and teaching these kids (cause that's what they are) how to be responsible for their money and spending it wisely. [/QUOTE]This is true, and maybe my brother and his wife (former marine, college educated and practicing nurse) are the exceptions to the rule, but I have yet to hear about them complaining about bills and not having money or not being happy with the exception to the fact that he hasn't been home due to being stationed overseas.

Peace [/QUOTE]I'd venture to say they are an exception also - the fact that she works in a professional field makes a major difference. I never understood why so many military families were so keen on having all these kids right away and the wives not work. Somehow I feel there is an illusion that you make enough money to support your family when you are in the military and that is just not entirely true for the rank and file. [/QUOTE]talk about a huge generalization. leslie, how can you say that this is an exception? what makes you so sure of this? i'm just wondering. true, you do see these kinda people but to make them appear as the norm is something i HAVE to disagree with being a former service member myself. [/QUOTE]actually, she based her observation on her experience. based on your experience what do you see as the norm? [/QUOTE]she did? i couldn't tell. so she was in too in some way, shape, or form? gotcha.

i can't comment on what is the norm because i can only comment on my personal experience. i served with some of the BEST men and women a guy from a small town in texas could dream. i LEARNED soooo much about me AND life. got to travel the world and get paid for it and now i have a pretty good job and make more than most of my friends that graduated from college. but i'm not satisfied with that as i am also taking advantage of one of my benefits that i EARNED by serving and that is the g.i. bill by going to school full time while i also work full time at a NOC for verizon. again, it would be difficult for me to answer what the norm is because i saw it all and for me to say one is more norm than the other would be irresponsible of me. but i will tell you this, the marine corps owes me NOTHING, i owe it everything. i know, especially on this site, i'll get labeled as brainwashed or a cheeseball but that's how i feel. and for the record, i was opposed to this military action because i still have friends that are in and overseas and i recently had my best friend called BACK into the service and is on his way to san diego right now as i type this and i didn't want to hear about him killed, or any of my other friends for that matter, over a miltary action that i felt we didn't deserve to be in.

[ April 09, 2003, 04:01 PM: Message edited by: JoeB ]

The Buddy Love Show

04-09-2003, 03:35 PM

Originally posted by JoeB:

i can't comment on what is the norm because i can only comment on my personal experience. i served with some of the BEST men and women a guy from a small town in texas could dream. i LEARNED soooo much about me AND life. got to travel the world and get paid for it and now i have a pretty good job and make more than most of my friends that graduated from college. but i'm not satisfied with that as i am also taking advantage of one of my benefits that i EARNED by serving and that is the g.i. bill by going to school full time while i also work full time at a NOC for verizon. again, it would be difficult for me to answer what the norm is because i saw it all and for me to say one is more norm than the other would be irresponsible of me. but i will tell you this, the marine corps owes me NOTHING, i owe it everything. i know, especially on this site, i'll get labeled as brainwashed or a cheeseball but that's how i feel. and for the record, i was opposed to this military action because i still have friends that are in and overseas and i recently had my best friend called BACK into the service and is on his way to san diego right now as i type this and i didn't want to hear about him killed, or any of my other friends for that matter, over a miltary action that i felt we didn't deserve to be in. [/QB]joe b

i'm not knocking the service..i have manyrelatives and freinds who benefitted by it and in retrospect i probably should have served some time too....
a lot of folks seem to get it twisted around the axle - we can disagree with the policy of this government and its decision to use force yet still support the trrops themselves...nobody hopes their freinds or family or hell even average americans lose their lives
but i reserve the right to dispute the use of force when it isn't necessary...as obviated by our success o the field Iraq was no threat to the USA. their is no evidence YET of wmd. he had been contained and restricted to his own country for years and lastly their has never been any evidence of any link to al Qaida (in fact Saddam is reviled by bin Laden)

so why the need to act now? why spend american lives needlessly?..why cause division amongst our staunchst allies? where are the wmd? how much will this cost and by extension couldn't that money have been put to better use in the USA (hell ny has had 2 property tax increases and now a round of civil layoffs is coming)? is it unpatriotic to ask questions ? - i'm not in the service so i'm not being insubordinate.
support of troops from ones own country is a given and a fallacious argument propped up by a fool of a president who isn't interested in "fuzzy numbers"

well i'm sorry but the devil IS in the details and many of us are going to voice our opposition labels be damned

p.s....i aint venting at you...you just have a good post and i think military service is a good option for some people....but i aint feelin the misuse of our troops on a personal "he tried to kill my dad" vendetta

mhd

04-09-2003, 03:45 PM

Originally posted by JoeB:
[/qb][/QUOTE]she did? i couldn't tell. so she was in too in some way, shape, or form? gotcha.

i can't comment on what is the norm because i can only comment on my personal experience. i served with some of the BEST men and women a guy from a small town in texas could dream. i LEARNED soooo much about me AND life. got to travel the world and get paid for it and now i have a pretty good job and make more than most of my friends that graduated from college. but i'm not satisfied with that as i am also taking advantage of one of my benefits that i EARNED by serving and that is the g.i. bill by going to school full time while i also work full time at a NOC for verizon. again, it would be difficult for me to answer what the norm is because i saw it all and for me to say one is more norm than the other would be irresponsible of me. but i will tell you this, the marine corps owes me NOTHING, i owe it everything. i know, especially on this site, i'll get labeled as brainwashed or a cheeseball but that's how i feel. and for the record, i was opposed to this military action because i still have friends that are in and overseas and i recently had my best friend called BACK into the service and is on his way to san diego right now as i type this and i didn't want to hear about him killed, or any of my other friends for that matter, over a miltary action that i felt we didn't deserve to be in. [/QB][/QUOTE]

there is definitely a way to make your military experience a positive one and the foundation for a great career. i'm glad you did. but if i'm poor, from a farm or small town or the projects, coming from a terrible public school system and gangs, drugs and violence outside of school - once i get in the military i probably won't make good choices and decisions to get the most out of it, even if i am highly intelligent with excellent survival skills

DJ Timmy Richardson

04-09-2003, 04:06 PM

Originally posted by mhd:
50 grand a year after 18 years!! for risking your life!!! slavery had to be more lucrative graemlins/rofl.gif

Billy Woods

04-09-2003, 04:09 PM

"I have family in the military so yes I do support them. I might not support the war or the policy that the US government has with other nations, but I do support our troops...ALWAYS! Without them, neither you nor I would be able to enjoy the freedom we have in this country such as being able to communicate and voice your opinion in a public forum such as the internet."

- Just as long as you don't express your opinion on mainstream media or you're likely to be sacked!

[ April 09, 2003, 05:23 PM: Message edited by: Billy Woods ]

DJ Timmy Richardson

04-09-2003, 04:10 PM

DJ Timmy Richardson

04-09-2003, 04:14 PM

Originally posted by konbit:
Check this weeks Newsweek for the racial percentages in the military. Be sure to check the part that shows the racial make up officers compared to enlisted...

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by mhd:
the high participation of brothers in the military is a reflection of poor high schools, lack of financial aid for college and lack of job opportunities. true or false [/QUOTE]I saw that Konby. Interesting page in fact

Leslie

04-09-2003, 04:19 PM

Originally posted by JoeB:
[she did? i couldn't tell. so she was in too in some way, shape, or form? gotcha.

[/QB]First of all, SHE has a name and its Leslie. Secondly my experience is based upon what I saw while in college in Hampton, VA surrounded by Langly AFB, The Amphibious (sp?) base in Norfolk, and the other bases scattered around VA Beach, etc. That is what my observations are based upon.

The military provides a great opportunity for many people and its benefits are great for many, and for those whose lives it changed I think its wonderful, I have no problem with anyone who wants to serve. But I am allowed to question when, where and why military force is used. Afterall just as they are suppossedly fighting for my way of life to be preserved, its my tax money that's helping to achieve all of this. If you support the action fine, if you don't support the action that does not make you a "bad American", it doesn't mean you don't love this country. I have no choice, I am here by default - certainly not via the choice of my ancestors. Given the many atrocities suffered by my people under the laws of this land I feel I am more than entitled to question, oppose, and speak out if I am not happy with what is going down. I know it won't make a difference, but at least I take, as do you, as side in all this. I don't feel your views are cheesy, I think they are all valid given your experiences. My experiences are just as valid - whether you or anyone else agrees with them is ultimately irrelevent.

JoeB

04-09-2003, 05:17 PM

Originally posted by Leslie:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by JoeB:
[she did? i couldn't tell. so she was in too in some way, shape, or form? gotcha.

First of all, SHE has a name and its Leslie.

The military provides a great opportunity for many people and its benefits are great for many, and for those whose lives it changed I think its wonderful, I have no problem with anyone who wants to serve. But I am allowed to question when, where and why military force is used. Afterall just as they are suppossedly fighting for my way of life to be preserved, its my tax money that's helping to achieve all of this. If you support the action fine, if you don't support the action that does not make you a "bad American", it doesn't mean you don't love this country. I have no choice, I am here by default - certainly not via the choice of my ancestors. Given the many atrocities suffered by my people under the laws of this land I feel I am more than entitled to question, oppose, and speak out if I am not happy with what is going down. I know it won't make a difference, but at least I take, as do you, as side in all this. I don't feel your views are cheesy, I think they are all valid given your experiences. My experiences are just as valid - whether you or anyone else agrees with them is ultimately irrelevent. [/QB][/QUOTE]wtf? reread my freaking post. i don't support this military action all the way or blindly JUST cause i served honorablly. we are NOT all blind sheep that do not how to think. and i didn't say your name because i was talking to mhd and i didn't think it was grammatically improper to do so. if you were offended by that pronoun, then i offer my sincerest apologies. other than that, i stand by what i wrote previously that i do NOT agree with you but you know what LESLIE, that's o.k.

Originally posted by Leslie:
Secondly my experience is based upon what I saw while in college in Hampton, VA surrounded by Langly AFB, The Amphibious (sp?) base in Norfolk, and the other bases scattered around VA Beach, etc. That is what my observations are based upon.
i respect your opinion but i just have a problem when you generalized like that because you just saw a small glimpse of what military life is all about and that's why i had to speak up but it was nothing personal.

[ April 09, 2003, 06:35 PM: Message edited by: JoeB ]

JoeB

04-09-2003, 05:25 PM

Originally posted by your idol, Buddy Love:

i'm not knocking the service..i have manyrelatives and freinds who benefitted by it and in retrospect i probably should have served some time too....
a lot of folks seem to get it twisted around the axle - we can disagree with the policy of this government and its decision to use force yet still support the trrops themselves...nobody hopes their freinds or family or hell even average americans lose their lives
but i reserve the right to dispute the use of force when it isn't necessary...as obviated by our success o the field Iraq was no threat to the USA. their is no evidence YET of wmd. he had been contained and restricted to his own country for years and lastly their has never been any evidence of any link to al Qaida (in fact Saddam is reviled by bin Laden)

so why the need to act now? why spend american lives needlessly?..why cause division amongst our staunchst allies? where are the wmd? how much will this cost and by extension couldn't that money have been put to better use in the USA (hell ny has had 2 property tax increases and now a round of civil layoffs is coming)? is it unpatriotic to ask questions ? - i'm not in the service so i'm not being insubordinate.
support of troops from ones own country is a given and a fallacious argument propped up by a fool of a president who isn't interested in "fuzzy numbers"

well i'm sorry but the devil IS in the details and many of us are going to voice our opposition labels be damned

p.s....i aint venting at you...you just have a good post and i think military service is a good option for some people....but i aint feelin the misuse of our troops on a personal "he tried to kill my dad" vendetta [/QB]buddy,

i know you are not venting at me because i agree with all of what you said on why we SHOULDN'T be at war. yes, i feel for the iraqi people when i read about some of the horrible things saddam has done in the past but are we the world's police now and are we are the mother to nurse every child back to healthy form? i don't think so but that's just MY opinion and it is something we are able to share and disgree with the powers that be without me feeling that you don't give a shit if my homeboys out there die or not. i never felt that from you or anyone. i would really hope and i'm sure that noone on here wishes that on any of OUR troops.

The Buddy Love Show

04-09-2003, 06:51 PM

its funny but i consider myself a patriot...i love america and what it stands for...however i'm still a dreamer and some of the things our government does in the the interests of the powerful shadow personages frightens me....too bad i wasn't born stupid so i can be more happy about the situation

Leslie

04-09-2003, 07:58 PM

Originally posted by JoeB:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Leslie:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by JoeB:
[she did? i couldn't tell. so she was in too in some way, shape, or form? gotcha.

First of all, SHE has a name and its Leslie.

The military provides a great opportunity for many people and its benefits are great for many, and for those whose lives it changed I think its wonderful, I have no problem with anyone who wants to serve. But I am allowed to question when, where and why military force is used. Afterall just as they are suppossedly fighting for my way of life to be preserved, its my tax money that's helping to achieve all of this. If you support the action fine, if you don't support the action that does not make you a "bad American", it doesn't mean you don't love this country. I have no choice, I am here by default - certainly not via the choice of my ancestors. Given the many atrocities suffered by my people under the laws of this land I feel I am more than entitled to question, oppose, and speak out if I am not happy with what is going down. I know it won't make a difference, but at least I take, as do you, as side in all this. I don't feel your views are cheesy, I think they are all valid given your experiences. My experiences are just as valid - whether you or anyone else agrees with them is ultimately irrelevent. [/QUOTE]wtf? reread my freaking post. i don't support this military action all the way or blindly JUST cause i served honorablly. we are NOT all blind sheep that do not how to think. and i didn't say your name because i was talking to mhd and i didn't think it was grammatically improper to do so. if you were offended by that pronoun, then i offer my sincerest apologies. other than that, i stand by what i wrote previously that i do NOT agree with you but you know what LESLIE, that's o.k.

Originally posted by Leslie:
Secondly my experience is based upon what I saw while in college in Hampton, VA surrounded by Langly AFB, The Amphibious (sp?) base in Norfolk, and the other bases scattered around VA Beach, etc. That is what my observations are based upon.
i respect your opinion but i just have a problem when you generalized like that because you just saw a small glimpse of what military life is all about and that's why i had to speak up but it was nothing personal. [/QB][/QUOTE]Reread...did you miss the word IF in all this?? Also, by stating that you take a side, I didn't specfify as to what side it was. Did I say you followed or any military person followed blindly? Don't mix my comments with someone elses - okay. Nobody's catching feelings here, chill. If you feel I generalized a bit too much, cool given your military career I could see where one may be partial to how things are portrayed by those who did not live the life, its all good. We don't agree. Who ever said we had too? Joe B that you feel you owe everything to the Marines speaks volumes in and of itself.

You start off by yelling at me and end it with nothing personal http://deephousepage.com/smilies/argue2.gif
graemlins/beerchug.gif
Life's too short to take anything that personal...except of course where Basecore Boy is concerned ;)

JoeB

04-09-2003, 08:10 PM

i started "yelling" off the bat because you pointed the whole "she has a name" thing to ME when mhd was the one that stated "she" first. but whatever, we can definitely agree to disagree.

[ April 09, 2003, 09:13 PM: Message edited by: JoeB ]

04-10-2003, 12:46 AM

Originally posted by konbit:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Albert D.:
I have family in the military so yes I do support them. graemlins/thumbsup.gif I might not support the war or the policy that the US government has with other nations, but I do support our troops...ALWAYS! Without them, neither you nor I would be able to enjoy the freedom we have in this country such as being able to communicate and voice your opinion in a public forum such as the internet.

GI Jane signing off! smokin.gif How quick people are to spout off tired cliches. Just out of curiosity...can you please tell me when the last time American troops protected the freedoms you list above? I would like a concrete example please.

Other catch phrases I hate:

"Hero"-You're not a hero unles you commit a heroic act. Simply joining the Armed Forces and doing what they tell you is not heroic.

"Weapons of Mass Destruction": a catch phrase used to inspire fear.; Please list examples of weapons that have caused "mass destruction," and who used them where and when.

"terror"/"terrorism": Anybody with half a brain should be disgusted with the misappropriations of this idea. [/QUOTE]Useless, just useless. Love it or LEAVE IT!...Period!

GROOVE VICTIM

04-10-2003, 06:40 AM

Originally posted by DJ Timmy Richardson:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Leslie:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by mhd:
50 grand a year after 18 years!! for risking your life!!! slavery had to be more lucrative I have to agree. Most military families are not doing well at all. The amount of money they make is minimal and often times not enough to support their families on, esp. with young kids and wives that do not work - which is usually the case. I saw loads of that while away at school. As for the debt, its ridiculous how much debt these soldiers get themselves into when they get out of basic and get assigned - the first thing they do is run out and buy a car because the dealers in military base areas make the prices so attractive and half of them can't even make the payments and pay the bills because they make so little. No money down - the military does not do a good job at all of being truthful about the amnount of moeny they will be making and teaching these kids (cause that's what they are) how to be responsible for their money and spending it wisely. [/QUOTE]Here are the figures.

$15,480 Base pay for Army pvt 1 yr service
$26,200 Starting salary for 2nd lieut
$150/month Average combat pay
$60,000 Deathe Gratuity
$250,000 Life Insurance [/QUOTE]Factor in free room and board because privates aren't allowed to live off base, free food, probably no car for the first year or so if you play your cards right.

Compare that to an 18 year old in the "world" then we can see the difference. Struggling at 6 bucks an hour trying to pay his or her way through college knowing in about 6 or seven years that same person has student loans and credit card debt out the yin yang to pay off.

Peace

lyot

04-10-2003, 06:49 AM

Originally posted by Albert D.:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by konbit:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Albert D.:
I have family in the military so yes I do support them. graemlins/thumbsup.gif I might not support the war or the policy that the US government has with other nations, but I do support our troops...ALWAYS! Without them, neither you nor I would be able to enjoy the freedom we have in this country such as being able to communicate and voice your opinion in a public forum such as the internet.

GI Jane signing off! smokin.gif How quick people are to spout off tired cliches. Just out of curiosity...can you please tell me when the last time American troops protected the freedoms you list above? I would like a concrete example please.

Other catch phrases I hate:

"Hero"-You're not a hero unles you commit a heroic act. Simply joining the Armed Forces and doing what they tell you is not heroic.

"Weapons of Mass Destruction": a catch phrase used to inspire fear.; Please list examples of weapons that have caused "mass destruction," and who used them where and when.

"terror"/"terrorism": Anybody with half a brain should be disgusted with the misappropriations of this idea. [/QUOTE]Useless, just useless. Love it or LEAVE IT!...Period! [/QUOTE]crucial ! I'm disgusted by the language that has been used to manipulate people's minds..People don't want to think, and they take for granted what's told to them..If only they would start realizing themselves how much the reality they live in is influenced by the deceitfull language that's being used;

mhd

04-10-2003, 07:39 AM

Originally posted by GROOVE VICTIM:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by DJ Timmy Richardson:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Leslie:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by mhd:
50 grand a year after 18 years!! for risking your life!!! slavery had to be more lucrative I have to agree. Most military families are not doing well at all. The amount of money they make is minimal and often times not enough to support their families on, esp. with young kids and wives that do not work - which is usually the case. I saw loads of that while away at school. As for the debt, its ridiculous how much debt these soldiers get themselves into when they get out of basic and get assigned - the first thing they do is run out and buy a car because the dealers in military base areas make the prices so attractive and half of them can't even make the payments and pay the bills because they make so little. No money down - the military does not do a good job at all of being truthful about the amnount of moeny they will be making and teaching these kids (cause that's what they are) how to be responsible for their money and spending it wisely. [/QUOTE]Here are the figures.

$15,480 Base pay for Army pvt 1 yr service
$26,200 Starting salary for 2nd lieut
$150/month Average combat pay
$60,000 Deathe Gratuity
$250,000 Life Insurance [/QUOTE]Factor in free room and board because privates aren't allowed to live off base, free food, probably no car for the first year or so if you play your cards right.

Compare that to an 18 year old in the "world" then we can see the difference. Struggling at 6 bucks an hour trying to pay his or her way through college knowing in about 6 or seven years that same person has student loans and credit card debt out the yin yang to pay off.

Peace [/QUOTE]factor in a little thing called an education... of course you are not saying its better to go into the military rather than go to college

GROOVE VICTIM

04-10-2003, 07:41 AM

Not at all, but at the same time there are enlisted men and women that take advantage of the military for the same outcome, an education.

Peace

konbit

04-10-2003, 09:44 AM

Originally posted by Albert D.:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by konbit:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Albert D.:
I have family in the military so yes I do support them. graemlins/thumbsup.gif I might not support the war or the policy that the US government has with other nations, but I do support our troops...ALWAYS! Without them, neither you nor I would be able to enjoy the freedom we have in this country such as being able to communicate and voice your opinion in a public forum such as the internet.

GI Jane signing off! smokin.gif How quick people are to spout off tired cliches. Just out of curiosity...can you please tell me when the last time American troops protected the freedoms you list above? I would like a concrete example please.

Other catch phrases I hate:

"Hero"-You're not a hero unles you commit a heroic act. Simply joining the Armed Forces and doing what they tell you is not heroic.

"Weapons of Mass Destruction": a catch phrase used to inspire fear.; Please list examples of weapons that have caused "mass destruction," and who used them where and when.

"terror"/"terrorism": Anybody with half a brain should be disgusted with the misappropriations of this idea. [/QUOTE]Useless, just useless. Love it or LEAVE IT!...Period! [/QUOTE]Oh yeah...I almost forgot. Thse stupidist phrase of them all: "Love it or leave it." It's like when you were a kid and you put your fingers in your ears and started to hum because you knew that you were in an argument that you weren't equipped to win.

Thank you Albert for demonstrating how empty, cliched, nationalistic language can be used instead of intelligent thought. And if you like "love it or leave it," you'll probably love another "patriotic" favorite: "Sieg heil!"

[ April 10, 2003, 10:53 AM: Message edited by: konbit ]

The Buddy Love Show

04-10-2003, 09:50 AM

Originally posted by konbit:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Albert D.:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by konbit:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Albert D.:
I have family in the military so yes I do support them. graemlins/thumbsup.gif I might not support the war or the policy that the US government has with other nations, but I do support our troops...ALWAYS! Without them, neither you nor I would be able to enjoy the freedom we have in this country such as being able to communicate and voice your opinion in a public forum such as the internet.

GI Jane signing off! smokin.gif How quick people are to spout off tired cliches. Just out of curiosity...can you please tell me when the last time American troops protected the freedoms you list above? I would like a concrete example please.

Other catch phrases I hate:

"Hero"-You're not a hero unles you commit a heroic act. Simply joining the Armed Forces and doing what they tell you is not heroic.

"Weapons of Mass Destruction": a catch phrase used to inspire fear.; Please list examples of weapons that have caused "mass destruction," and who used them where and when.

"terror"/"terrorism": Anybody with half a brain should be disgusted with the misappropriations of this idea. [/QUOTE]Useless, just useless. Love it or LEAVE IT!...Period! [/QUOTE]Oh yeah...I almost forgot. Thse stupist phrase of them all: "Love it or leave it." It's like when you were a kid and you put your fingers in your ears and started to hum because you knew that you were in an argument that you weren't equipped to win.

Thank you Albert for demonstrating how empty, cliched, nationalistic language can be used instead of intelligent thought. And if you like "love it or leave it," you'll probably love another "patriotic" favorite: "Sieg heil!" [/QUOTE]konbit...you might as well argue with a bumper sticker - same depth of thought

konbit

04-10-2003, 09:52 AM

And let me just clarify...I'm just poking fun at Albert. My point it: These discussions have nothing to do with how much you do or don't "love your country." Such rhetoric just gets in the way of having reasonable, meaningful discussions. These phrases are used to bring out people's emotions without relying on facts and ideas.

"Peace!" (hahahaha)

konbit

04-10-2003, 09:58 AM

Originally posted by your idol, Buddy Love:
you might as well argue with a bumper stickerHahahahaha!! Unfortunately, quoting bumber sticker slogans seems to be the extent of sooooo many people's political discourse these days.

04-10-2003, 11:26 AM

Originally posted by konbit:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Albert D.:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by konbit:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Albert D.:
I have family in the military so yes I do support them. graemlins/thumbsup.gif I might not support the war or the policy that the US government has with other nations, but I do support our troops...ALWAYS! Without them, neither you nor I would be able to enjoy the freedom we have in this country such as being able to communicate and voice your opinion in a public forum such as the internet.

GI Jane signing off! smokin.gif How quick people are to spout off tired cliches. Just out of curiosity...can you please tell me when the last time American troops protected the freedoms you list above? I would like a concrete example please.

Other catch phrases I hate:

"Hero"-You're not a hero unles you commit a heroic act. Simply joining the Armed Forces and doing what they tell you is not heroic.

"Weapons of Mass Destruction": a catch phrase used to inspire fear.; Please list examples of weapons that have caused "mass destruction," and who used them where and when.

"terror"/"terrorism": Anybody with half a brain should be disgusted with the misappropriations of this idea. [/QUOTE]Useless, just useless. Love it or LEAVE IT!...Period! [/QUOTE]Oh yeah...I almost forgot. Thse stupidist phrase of them all: "Love it or leave it." It's like when you were a kid and you put your fingers in your ears and started to hum because you knew that you were in an argument that you weren't equipped to win.

Thank you Albert for demonstrating how empty, cliched, nationalistic language can be used instead of intelligent thought. And if you like "love it or leave it," you'll probably love another "patriotic" favorite: "Sieg heil!" [/QUOTE]Sieg heil??? Now where did that come from? I'm not about to waste my time with someone that has a mindset like you. It's obvious that you are already set with your thoughts and beliefs and my "Nazi-minded" brain is not about to debate another minute with someone that talks about peace, yet, they don't truly have it in them. Check yourself before you preach.

peace,

AD

04-10-2003, 11:29 AM

Originally posted by your idol, Buddy Love:
QUOTE]konbit...you might as well argue with a bumper sticker - same depth of thought I could easily say the same thing about your anti-American, protesting, know-it-all rhetoric.

peace,

AD

formerly known as kenspank

04-10-2003, 11:51 AM

ho hum.

konbit

04-10-2003, 12:35 PM

Originally posted by Albert D.:
Sieg heil??? Now where did that come from? I'm not about to waste my time with someone that has a mindset like you. It's obvious that you are already set with your thoughts and beliefs and my "Nazi-minded" brain is not about to debate another minute with someone that talks about peace, yet, they don't truly have it in them. Check yourself before you preach.

peace,

AD You have proven that you have totally missed the point. Please re-read my posts in this thread again (slowly) to see what I'm talking about...and no, it's not even about the war.

Also...I'd like you to substantiate your claim that I don't have peace in me...as you say.

And, I don't think that you and I have ever "debated." So, I'm not sure how you can stop. I just went on a search of your past posts, and i am unable to find the above-mentioned debates. (I suggest you look up the definition of "debate")

I'm not trying to be mean spirited, but I think that your rhetoric is very weak.

Ken1015

04-10-2003, 12:49 PM

Konbit, you either support us or we'll consider you an enemy you french fry and brie eating commie.

konbit

04-10-2003, 01:09 PM

Hahahaha

Bill Blake

04-10-2003, 01:23 PM

FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

GROOVE VICTIM

04-10-2003, 01:28 PM

10 print "FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!";
run
20 goto 10
run

Jamie Lennox just gave me a Basic flashback!!!

imported_Gman

04-10-2003, 02:00 PM

Originally posted by GROOVE VICTIM:
10 print "FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!";
run
20 goto 10
run

Jamie Lennox just gave me a Basic flashback!!! Are you trying to crash the board graemlins/jpshakehead.gif

Begin
Count = 0;
10 print "FREEDOM FRIES WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!";
Count = count + 1
if (count le 25) then
goto 10
else
goto 20
endif
20 End

GROOVE VICTIM

04-10-2003, 02:03 PM

Aww man don't let me pull out my Turbo Pascal books from highschool!!!

graemlins/rofl.gif

The Buddy Love Show

04-10-2003, 02:09 PM

Originally posted by Albert D.:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by your idol, Buddy Love:
QUOTE]konbit...you might as well argue with a bumper sticker - same depth of thought I could easily say the same thing about your anti-American, protesting, know-it-all rhetoric.

peace,

AD [/QUOTE]when ya see me use a phrase like "love it or leave it" or "only the outlaws will have guns" or any other bumper sticker phrases to justify my position ya can slap me right here

The Buddy Love Show

04-10-2003, 02:11 PM

Originally posted by kenspank:
ho hum. not if shes under 18 - you can hum that ho by yourself

LEONARD REMIX RROY

04-10-2003, 03:10 PM

Originally posted by mhd:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by GROOVE VICTIM:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by DJ Timmy Richardson:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Leslie:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by mhd:
50 grand a year after 18 years!! for risking your life!!! slavery had to be more lucrative I have to agree. Most military families are not doing well at all. The amount of money they make is minimal and often times not enough to support their families on, esp. with young kids and wives that do not work - which is usually the case. I saw loads of that while away at school. As for the debt, its ridiculous how much debt these soldiers get themselves into when they get out of basic and get assigned - the first thing they do is run out and buy a car because the dealers in military base areas make the prices so attractive and half of them can't even make the payments and pay the bills because they make so little. No money down - the military does not do a good job at all of being truthful about the amnount of moeny they will be making and teaching these kids (cause that's what they are) how to be responsible for their money and spending it wisely. [/QUOTE]Here are the figures.

$15,480 Base pay for Army pvt 1 yr service
$26,200 Starting salary for 2nd lieut
$150/month Average combat pay
$60,000 Deathe Gratuity
$250,000 Life Insurance [/QUOTE]Factor in free room and board because privates aren't allowed to live off base, free food, probably no car for the first year or so if you play your cards right.

Compare that to an 18 year old in the "world" then we can see the difference. Struggling at 6 bucks an hour trying to pay his or her way through college knowing in about 6 or seven years that same person has student loans and credit card debt out the yin yang to pay off.

Peace [/QUOTE]factor in a little thing called an education... of course you are not saying its better to go into the military rather than go to college [/QUOTE]Factor in todays military promotes college and has courses available on every base at the ED Center. Factor in the training recieved in the military in transfurable college credits.

A soldier stationed at Ft. Leonard Wood MO, can attend Missouri State University (which is located 30 minutes away) for night classes (at goverment expense) for the duration that they are stationed there (which is generally 3 years)

The Marines are really hard core, so hard core that a Marine got out of this on going war to sing on American Idol.

The military is not what it used to be 10 years ago. I was in the Army, a Combat Engineer and now I am working my way to become a full-time Air Force member. 10 years ago the Air Force would no accept me because I was coming from another branch or service, now I am in the process of jumping branches plus I got a $3000 signing bonus.

The Air Force is the way to go over-all but, the other branches are good also if a person wanna join smile.gif

mhd

04-10-2003, 03:44 PM

Originally posted by LEONARD REMIX RROY:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by mhd:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by GROOVE VICTIM:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by DJ Timmy Richardson:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Leslie:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by mhd:
50 grand a year after 18 years!! for risking your life!!! slavery had to be more lucrative I have to agree. Most military families are not doing well at all. The amount of money they make is minimal and often times not enough to support their families on, esp. with young kids and wives that do not work - which is usually the case. I saw loads of that while away at school. As for the debt, its ridiculous how much debt these soldiers get themselves into when they get out of basic and get assigned - the first thing they do is run out and buy a car because the dealers in military base areas make the prices so attractive and half of them can't even make the payments and pay the bills because they make so little. No money down - the military does not do a good job at all of being truthful about the amnount of moeny they will be making and teaching these kids (cause that's what they are) how to be responsible for their money and spending it wisely. [/QUOTE]Here are the figures.

$15,480 Base pay for Army pvt 1 yr service
$26,200 Starting salary for 2nd lieut
$150/month Average combat pay
$60,000 Deathe Gratuity
$250,000 Life Insurance [/QUOTE]Factor in free room and board because privates aren't allowed to live off base, free food, probably no car for the first year or so if you play your cards right.

Compare that to an 18 year old in the "world" then we can see the difference. Struggling at 6 bucks an hour trying to pay his or her way through college knowing in about 6 or seven years that same person has student loans and credit card debt out the yin yang to pay off.

Peace [/QUOTE]factor in a little thing called an education... of course you are not saying its better to go into the military rather than go to college [/QUOTE]Factor in todays military promotes college and has courses available on every base at the ED Center. Factor in the training recieved in the military in transfurable college credits.

A soldier stationed at Ft. Leonard Wood MO, can attend Missouri State University (which is located 30 minutes away) for night classes (at goverment expense) for the duration that they are stationed there (which is generally 3 years)

The Marines are really hard core, so hard core that a Marine got out of this on going war to sing on American Idol.

The military is not what it used to be 10 years ago. I was in the Army, a Combat Engineer and now I am working my way to become a full-time Air Force member. 10 years ago the Air Force would no accept me because I was coming from another branch or service, now I am in the process of jumping branches plus I got a $3000 signing bonus.

The Air Force is the way to go over-all but, the other branches are good also if a person wanna join smile.gif [/QUOTE]factor in a little thing like today's military can get you killed. why not just attend Missouri State University without joining the military. sure it will take some effort and sacrifice. what if Missouri State told you you could go there for free in exhchange for working in the gym for four years?

isn't it true that a person would join only because all other options have failed? that's not a knock on the person, it takes a lot of heart just to survive just a week at basic

lesysteme

04-10-2003, 08:13 PM

ill add that yes, what buddy and konbit said.

these ideas that somehow if we dont support this war we are unpatriotic or somehow dont support the troops are very depressing.

the tenor of the country has changed dramatically since sept 11, and unfort for the worst in my opinion.

These phrases like love it or leave it were also involked at those wishing change in issues of society such as civil rights..how quickly we forget.

Albert, you missed the point of the post and also shot back with some mud slinging yourself. Calling Konbit unpatriotic was a show of knee jerk reactions on your part, in my view anyways.

These are troubled times we are entering. Our ability to say anything contrary to govt opinion has repercussions last associated with the macarthy era.

let us be strong as a nation and be lead by our own knowledge, not by our collective fears.

O'love

04-11-2003, 02:56 AM

i don't know about the US, but i always have to cry and laugh at the same time when i hear Dutch military-people talking.... they only seem to join the army (except for the specialised forces like marines and pilots etc.) to earn some nice money, get some good food, and have some nice training..... but they don't seem to understand what the real purpose of an army is....to fight...they were even complaining that people where shooting at them when they had to go to yugoslavia under the UN flag..... a soldier complaining that he/she is shot at??? don't make me laugh..... i feel sorry for the US military people that only wanted to have a good education and some money and now are forced to kill other human beings in Iraq..but that's the consequences of joining the army....you know that upfront..

Olaf

GROOVE VICTIM

04-11-2003, 07:38 AM

lyot

04-11-2003, 07:41 AM

Originally posted by GROOVE VICTIM:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by mhd:
factor in a little thing like today's military can get you killed. why not just attend Missouri State University without joining the military. sure it will take some effort and sacrifice. what if Missouri State told you you could go there for free in exhchange for working in the gym for four years?

isn't it true that a person would join only because all other options have failed? that's not a knock on the person, it takes a lot of heart just to survive just a week at basic Today's military can get you killed. The same can be said 20 years ago, 30, 40, 50, 60, and 70 years ago.

What can young kids do when they grow up in an econonically depressed area where he or she has no other alternative but to join the military. Some of the kids that I work with are able to go to some fo the Technical Schools in the area, but once they graduate, who comes to the Job Fairs? Micky D's, Burger King, and Local Factories. I'm constantly telling these kids that they are going to have to move out of this area in order for them to make a good living.

There are "Plantations" still floating around this country. Trane, known for their air conditioning and heating systems has a plant near by and what do they do to persuade people to join their company. Increase of wages every six months to a maximum of 10 bucks an hour, "Nice" benefits, and some kinda of "Inflation" bonus. High School kids flock to this factory all the time. Here's the catch, you can't be late more thatn three times or you're dismissed. If you have children and they become sick, that counts against you can be a legitimate reason for dismissal. I've seen many people loose their jobs because they took their family responsibilities over their employment responsiblities. That's a damn shame.

Peace [/QUOTE]you guys need stronger trade unions..

Ken1015

04-11-2003, 07:55 AM

Originally posted by LEONARD REMIX RROY:
I was in the Army, a Combat Engineer and now I am working my way to become a full-time Air Force member.
Wait a minute. Forget all that other stuff. Does this mean you eventually won't be coming out on Mondays anymore?

LEONARD REMIX RROY

04-11-2003, 02:51 PM

Originally posted by mhd:
factor in a little thing like today's military can get you killed. why not just attend Missouri State University without joining the military. sure it will take some effort and sacrifice. what if Missouri State told you you could go there for free in exhchange for working in the gym for four years?

isn't it true that a person would join only because all other options have failed? that's not a knock on the person, it takes a lot of heart just to survive just a week at basic [/QB]More Black youths in the ghetto have killed each other in a larger number than Black service members who have been killed in action since Vietnam. Black man have far less of a chance of being killed in the military than trying to survive living on the south side of Chicago.

A 18 year old father from the ghetto with a highschool diploma can do more for their child being in the military than working for minimun wage.

Single parent females can do the same and give their child a better life in a drug free area via the military.

what if Missouri State told you you could go there for free in exhchange that is not a reality but, going for free via the military is (tuition does not come out your pocket)

In January I helped a younglady enlist into a job of choice. She recently finished Basic Training and she goes in as an officer + she recieved an $8000 signing bonus and the Army paid off all her college debt.

What I notice (and this is not directed at you personally) is:
Black people always talk about what they herd without doing research to get the true facts on a issue. "I herd that Blacks are put into combat jobs" For every 9 White combat soldiers there is only 1 Black soldier in that job title.

Most Black service members hold specialized jobs and jobs that require a Top Secret security clearance.

There is a the 5034th USAR School is 80% Black and all of the Senior staff - Officers & Enlisted - are black.

When I was a Tele-communications center operator in a medical unit we had a 8 soldier staff, 5 Black men 1 black woman and 2 White soldiers. Our NCOIC (person in-charge) was Black - so was the second in command.

The facts are there to discount the thought that Blacks in the military are only Cooks or Infantry.

There are options for Black youths in urban ghettos via Pell grants, Student Loans etc but, the military is the best option for thoughs who don't make the grade to go away to college.

I use the movie "Boyz N the Hood" for example, a young lady is sitting at a computer doing her homework and there is gunfire from a drive by, she throw down her pen out of frustation. How the hell you gonna study for college exams with all that violence distracting a person?

factor in a little thing like today's military can get you killed. There has not been an incident of a stray bullet killing a child as they played outside or in their room - on a military base. There are no street gang turf wars on a military base.

Work you way thru school so you can get a good job and leave the ghetto (v.s.) enlist into any branch of service and instantly get out the ghetto.

Young Black men are killed on the streets of Chicago and their family is left with the debt to bury them and if they leave children behind - the children are left with nothing due to no life insurance policy.

Too many Black people in the hood do more complaining about their situation than doing a quick fix military move to better their life.

The military is a Sh-t or get off the pot organization that mastered the art of no nonsense quick fixes.

LEONARD REMIX RROY

04-11-2003, 02:57 PM

Originally posted by Soulful1015:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by LEONARD REMIX RROY:
I was in the Army, a Combat Engineer and now I am working my way to become a full-time Air Force member.
Wait a minute. Forget all that other stuff. Does this mean you eventually won't be coming out on Mondays anymore? [/QUOTE]I am planing a retirement party for July 3, 2003. My heart is not in it anymore and I have starting passing on my tricks of the trade to other DJ's. I love you all but I have had enough and it is time for me to go. Spinning once brough me joy but now it is begining to depress me due to the climate of hate that I see and encounter in Chicago.

mhd

04-11-2003, 04:17 PM

Originally posted by LEONARD REMIX RROY:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by mhd:
factor in a little thing like today's military can get you killed. why not just attend Missouri State University without joining the military. sure it will take some effort and sacrifice. what if Missouri State told you you could go there for free in exhchange for working in the gym for four years?

isn't it true that a person would join only because all other options have failed? that's not a knock on the person, it takes a lot of heart just to survive just a week at basic More Black youths in the ghetto have killed each other in a larger number than Black service members who have been killed in action since Vietnam. Black man have far less of a chance of being killed in the military than trying to survive living on the south side of Chicago.

A 18 year old father from the ghetto with a highschool diploma can do more for their child being in the military than working for minimun wage.

Single parent females can do the same and give their child a better life in a drug free area via the military.

what if Missouri State told you you could go there for free in exhchange that is not a reality but, going for free via the military is (tuition does not come out your pocket)

In January I helped a younglady enlist into a job of choice. She recently finished Basic Training and she goes in as an officer + she recieved an $8000 signing bonus and the Army paid off all her college debt.

What I notice (and this is not directed at you personally) is:
Black people always talk about what they herd without doing research to get the true facts on a issue. "I herd that Blacks are put into combat jobs" For every 9 White combat soldiers there is only 1 Black soldier in that job title.

Most Black service members hold specialized jobs and jobs that require a Top Secret security clearance.

There is a the 5034th USAR School is 80% Black and all of the Senior staff - Officers & Enlisted - are black.

When I was a Tele-communications center operator in a medical unit we had a 8 soldier staff, 5 Black men 1 black woman and 2 White soldiers. Our NCOIC (person in-charge) was Black - so was the second in command.

The facts are there to discount the thought that Blacks in the military are only Cooks or Infantry.

There are options for Black youths in urban ghettos via Pell grants, Student Loans etc but, the military is the best option for thoughs who don't make the grade to go away to college.

I use the movie "Boyz N the Hood" for example, a young lady is sitting at a computer doing her homework and there is gunfire from a drive by, she throw down her pen out of frustation. How the hell you gonna study for college exams with all that violence distracting a person?

factor in a little thing like today's military can get you killed. There has not been an incident of a stray bullet killing a child as they played outside or in their room - on a military base. There are no street gang turf wars on a military base.

Work you way thru school so you can get a good job and leave the ghetto (v.s.) enlist into any branch of service and instantly get out the ghetto.

Young Black men are killed on the streets of Chicago and their family is left with the debt to bury them and if they leave children behind - the children are left with nothing due to no life insurance policy.

Too many Black people in the hood do more complaining about their situation than doing a quick fix military move to better their life.

The military is a Sh-t or get off the pot organization that mastered the art of no nonsense quick fixes. [/QB][/QUOTE]let's be clear about a few things, i grew up on 53rd st. in chicago, not too far from G or you o when i speak about the military I am speaking from personal experience. trust me, all of the military benefits you speak of can't compare to the deal i got. like you, i have many friends that chose the military, of the two that were in the marine corps one is homeless and the other died of aids after a heroin addiction, one of my other boys got out as a paratrooper and joined the vice lords.

there is one major problem with the comparisons that you make, you are comparing the military to living in chicago. that is no comparison. chicago is one of the toughest places to make it. you know that first hand. G and linda had to leave to make it, so did i. you remind me of so many of my family and friends who are smart and talented but can't get a break. as much as i love the chi, i realized that it will beat you down and destroy your scope and ability to realize other possibilities.

you said the missouri state scenario is not reality, not only is it a reality, i have seen it happen. not only that, i can show you how to do it for yourself.

i do agree with you somewhat, in fact, i have to, because i am a living example of everything you said. my main point is yes you can escape the ghetto through the military, you can also escape it through college. the survival skills and change in behavior it takes to adapt to the military are the same skills it takes to make it in college. but, as you know, many troops try to hold on to a hood mentality and identity in the mitlitary. so you do your tour or two, but you don't have a transferable skill to the private sector, and you go right back to the hood you left, you just another broke mother****er trying to make it.

you mentioned boys in the hood, what were the main points in the movie, morris chestnut got a passing score on the test, so he was going to college. cuba gooding's father was smart enough to get his son the **** out of compton and sent him to morehouse and cuba's girl went to spellman. man there are so many talented brothers in the hood, but they let racism and poverty and violence hold them back

farleyfan

04-12-2003, 10:16 AM

Leonard Remix Rroy, I'd like to see all the people who bash the military try to stop terrorism/attacks without military force. And EVERY and I mean EVERY time someone who sais we shouldn't be at war is asked how they would disintegrate terrorism(the loss of innocent lives) without force, the answer is always the same: "Well, I don't know, but....." Saddam Hussein was given over 10 years to show if he has chemical weapons or not-what the hell are we supposed to do???? Sit here with our heads up our ***es and wait for him for another 10 years? Another 20 years??? I know, we shouldn't be over there, even though the Iraqi people were hugging the coalition soldiers, knocking over the statue of Saddam Hussein. I guess the climate of hate that Leonard was talking about is this: If the terrorist attacks of 9-11 or any future attacks don't affect any individuals here DIRECTLY, "oh well". Excuse me if some of us here care about others besides our damn selves. I agree Leonard-the climate of hate is un freakin' believable. I don't know where all the anger and frustration comes from. How many damn times after terrorist attacks to U.S. interests overseas and the '93 WTC bombing did Clinton say, "Those responsible will be hunted down and punished." Al-Qaeda couldn't have been laughing any harder. And they proved how little credibility Clinton had in retribution and showed us all on September 11 '01.

martino

04-12-2003, 10:44 AM

Originally posted by farleyfan:
Leonard Remix Rroy, I'd like to see all the people who bash the military try to stop terrorism/attacks without military force. And EVERY and I mean EVERY time someone who sais we shouldn't be at war is asked how they would disintegrate terrorism(the loss of innocent lives) without force, the answer is always the same: "Well, I don't know, but....." Saddam Hussein was given over 10 years to show if he has chemical weapons or not-what the hell are we supposed to do???? Sit here with our heads up our ***es and wait for him for another 10 years? Another 20 years??? I know, we shouldn't be over there, even though the Iraqi people were hugging the coalition soldiers, knocking over the statue of Saddam Hussein. I guess the climate of hate that Leonard was talking about is this: If the terrorist attacks of 9-11 or any future attacks don't affect any individuals here DIRECTLY, "oh well". Excuse me if some of us here care about others besides our damn selves. I agree Leonard-the climate of hate is un freakin' believable. I don't know where all the anger and frustration comes from. How many damn times after terrorist attacks to U.S. interests overseas and the '93 WTC bombing did Clinton say, "Those responsible will be hunted down and punished." Al-Qaeda couldn't have been laughing any harder. And they proved how little credibility Clinton had in retribution and showed us all on September 11 '01. Most people i've seen debate war dont answer "i dont know but...". Not even on this board.
Do you believe that the best way to deal with crime is increase police and make punishment harder? You dont think addressing social issues might diminish crime?
Since this war started there has been a new invention in terrorism - the iraqi suicide bomber. There weren't any before the war, now this war against terrorism (i mean regime change, er, i mean iraqi dissarmament) has created more terrorists.

DJ Timmy Richardson

04-12-2003, 11:09 AM

Originally posted by farleyfan:
Leonard Remix Rroy, I'd like to see all the people who bash the military try to stop terrorism/attacks without military force. And EVERY and I mean EVERY time someone who sais we shouldn't be at war is asked how they would disintegrate terrorism(the loss of innocent lives) without force, the answer is always the same: "Well, I don't know, but....." Saddam Hussein was given over 10 years to show if he has chemical weapons or not-what the hell are we supposed to do???? Sit here with our heads up our ***es and wait for him for another 10 years? Another 20 years??? I know, we shouldn't be over there, even though the Iraqi people were hugging the coalition soldiers, knocking over the statue of Saddam Hussein. I guess the climate of hate that Leonard was talking about is this: If the terrorist attacks of 9-11 or any future attacks don't affect any individuals here DIRECTLY, "oh well". Excuse me if some of us here care about others besides our damn selves. I agree Leonard-the climate of hate is un freakin' believable. I don't know where all the anger and frustration comes from. How many damn times after terrorist attacks to U.S. interests overseas and the '93 WTC bombing did Clinton say, "Those responsible will be hunted down and punished." Al-Qaeda couldn't have been laughing any harder. And they proved how little credibility Clinton had in retribution and showed us all on September 11 '01. Well I'm glad victory was had. Cuz now all the terrorism in the world has been stopped. By your logic, going in a using miltary force, is as much a deterrent to terrorism, as capital punishment is to murder.