mdpm99
07-30-2003, 12:23 PM
Subj: David Rubinson on Moby Grape STEREO debacle...
Hello MOJO,
I just had a chance to see your piece about Moby Grape being a doomed band, etc.
One thing that needs to be cleared up, especially in light of the present day insane persecution of music fans being perpetrated by the current day record companies.
You said that I didn't realize that the stereo mixes of the first Grape Album would not play on FM radio.
Here's the horrible REAL story.
In those days, we did DIFFERENT mixes for the MONO and for the STEREO versions of each album. That's right. There was DUAL inventory at record stores, and the stereo album was about a dollar more at retail.
This was because many people still only had MONO record players !!!
Anyway- There was no way, at that time, to do just one master stereo mix, and then combine the two tracks into a mono record.
So- I did a MONO mix and a STEREO mix.
In a stupid moment of creative inspiration, I decided to put the BG vocals out of phase slightly, to make them appear to come from outside the stereo spectrum, and seem to be BEHIND the listener.
I used this on a few other instruments as well.
Naturally, when I made the MONO mix, I did not do this, and it would have been not only moot, but impossible with only one sound source.
Soooo- when the album came out, WNEW FM in New York played it right away, and I heard Jocko give a big hype, and announce some of the songs. Very few FM stations were broadcasting in stereo then.
I was listening on my stereo FM setup, and was thrilled. But I went into the kitchen for a drink, and turned on the MONO little radio that was in there.
The BG vocals were MISSING.
I called the station.
What the F is going on ?? I yelled ?
Huh ? They said. Sounds good here ?!?!?!
I went back to the stereo radio setup. Poifeckt. BG vocals etc.
What did this mean ?
Well, since radio (see above) was still 99% mono, the record companies serviced them with the MONO mix of the albums. This was because a stereo record played in Mono would have the center material DOUBLE in amplitude when the 2 tracks were combined equally into a mono playback. (I can explain this if anyone is interested). So the mix would be screwed.
Which is why we did separate mono mixes. And why radio got mono records.
But- what had happened on the Grape album was-
get this in light of the RIAA subpoenas etc--
Columbia Records, in an ignorant attempt to save money- and without divulging it to anyone- had pressed ONLY STEREO ALBUMS, and simply put mono labels on some of them, and sold some as stereo and some as mono. I went to a store and BOUGHT one of each.
Well, of course, the stereo records played on mono equipment, or ON THE RADIO sounded awful, and of course, the out of phase material (including BG vocals) CANCELLED, disappeared almost 100% !!
I called everyone at the executive level of the company. I ranted and raved. Nada.
They just stonewalled me, and smiled in my face.
A year of work, pissed on.
That was ohhhhhh maybe 1967 ?
And nothing much has changed.
And there's THAT story.
Best regards,
David Rubinson
Producer of Moby Grape
Quote of The Day:
"One human future doesn't exist, neither does one image of the future. There are thousands of possibilities to make the world more human. I realize this is a vulnerable position, since those in favor of globalization do have one clear image. Their vision is like a sharp, gleaming knife put on our throats. Our answer doesn't consist of an alternative, as simple as theirs, but of the confirmation of diversity's wealth, in every possible way. There are countless ways of ruling a country, countless ways of protecting nature, countless ways of being a human being, countless ways to stand up straight and voice your opinion.
"Those asking after our alternative to neo-liberal globalization, actually expect an answer as violent and totalitarian as the one we reject. We are not looking for one answer. We only ask for the current brutality to stop, to create new space for thousands of possible answers."
Hello MOJO,
I just had a chance to see your piece about Moby Grape being a doomed band, etc.
One thing that needs to be cleared up, especially in light of the present day insane persecution of music fans being perpetrated by the current day record companies.
You said that I didn't realize that the stereo mixes of the first Grape Album would not play on FM radio.
Here's the horrible REAL story.
In those days, we did DIFFERENT mixes for the MONO and for the STEREO versions of each album. That's right. There was DUAL inventory at record stores, and the stereo album was about a dollar more at retail.
This was because many people still only had MONO record players !!!
Anyway- There was no way, at that time, to do just one master stereo mix, and then combine the two tracks into a mono record.
So- I did a MONO mix and a STEREO mix.
In a stupid moment of creative inspiration, I decided to put the BG vocals out of phase slightly, to make them appear to come from outside the stereo spectrum, and seem to be BEHIND the listener.
I used this on a few other instruments as well.
Naturally, when I made the MONO mix, I did not do this, and it would have been not only moot, but impossible with only one sound source.
Soooo- when the album came out, WNEW FM in New York played it right away, and I heard Jocko give a big hype, and announce some of the songs. Very few FM stations were broadcasting in stereo then.
I was listening on my stereo FM setup, and was thrilled. But I went into the kitchen for a drink, and turned on the MONO little radio that was in there.
The BG vocals were MISSING.
I called the station.
What the F is going on ?? I yelled ?
Huh ? They said. Sounds good here ?!?!?!
I went back to the stereo radio setup. Poifeckt. BG vocals etc.
What did this mean ?
Well, since radio (see above) was still 99% mono, the record companies serviced them with the MONO mix of the albums. This was because a stereo record played in Mono would have the center material DOUBLE in amplitude when the 2 tracks were combined equally into a mono playback. (I can explain this if anyone is interested). So the mix would be screwed.
Which is why we did separate mono mixes. And why radio got mono records.
But- what had happened on the Grape album was-
get this in light of the RIAA subpoenas etc--
Columbia Records, in an ignorant attempt to save money- and without divulging it to anyone- had pressed ONLY STEREO ALBUMS, and simply put mono labels on some of them, and sold some as stereo and some as mono. I went to a store and BOUGHT one of each.
Well, of course, the stereo records played on mono equipment, or ON THE RADIO sounded awful, and of course, the out of phase material (including BG vocals) CANCELLED, disappeared almost 100% !!
I called everyone at the executive level of the company. I ranted and raved. Nada.
They just stonewalled me, and smiled in my face.
A year of work, pissed on.
That was ohhhhhh maybe 1967 ?
And nothing much has changed.
And there's THAT story.
Best regards,
David Rubinson
Producer of Moby Grape
Quote of The Day:
"One human future doesn't exist, neither does one image of the future. There are thousands of possibilities to make the world more human. I realize this is a vulnerable position, since those in favor of globalization do have one clear image. Their vision is like a sharp, gleaming knife put on our throats. Our answer doesn't consist of an alternative, as simple as theirs, but of the confirmation of diversity's wealth, in every possible way. There are countless ways of ruling a country, countless ways of protecting nature, countless ways of being a human being, countless ways to stand up straight and voice your opinion.
"Those asking after our alternative to neo-liberal globalization, actually expect an answer as violent and totalitarian as the one we reject. We are not looking for one answer. We only ask for the current brutality to stop, to create new space for thousands of possible answers."