@@ - "eyes only"

[mdpm99]

Greetings:

Please read all the way thru until the LAST sentence....

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d


Q) At the end of the day who do you think is really getting ripped off is it the music industry?

A) No, if you ask me then I would say that its the artists who made the songs at first place is getting ripped off. Why because take a look:

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(Advance: $250,000) (Manager's cut: $37,500) (Legal fees: $10,000)
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(Recording Budget: $150,000) (Producer's advance: $50,000) (Lodgings while in studio: $10,000)
(Drum, Amp, Mic: $3,000) (Recording tape: $8,000) (Equipment rental: $5,000)
(Cartage and Transportation: $5,000) (Mastering: $10,000) (Catering: $3,000)
(Tape copies, reference CDs, shipping tapes, misc expenses: $2,000) (Studio fee: $52,500)
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(Video budget: $30,000) (Cameras: $8,000) (Crew: $5,000) (Processing and transfers: $3,000 )
(Offline: $2,000) (Online editing: $3,000) (Stage and construction: $3,000) (Catering: $1,000)
(Copies, couriers, transportation: $2,000) (Director's fee: $3,000)
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(Album Artwork: $5,000) (Promotional photo shoot and duplication: $2,000)
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(Band fund: $15,000) (New fancy professional drum kit: $5,000) (Rehearsal space rental: $500)
(New fancy professional guitars (2): $3,000) (New fancy potato-shaped bass guitar: $1,000)
(New fancy rack of lights bass amp: $1,000) (Big blowout party for their friends: $500)
(New fancy professional guitar amp rigs (2): $4,000)
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(Tour expense (5 weeks): $50,875) (Bus: $25,000) (Crew (3): $7,500) (Food and per diems: $7,875)
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(Fuel: $3,000) (Consumable supplies: $3,500) (Wardrobe: $1,000) (Promotion: $3,000)
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(Tour gross income: $50,000) (Agent s cut: $7,500) (Manager's cut: $7,500)
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(Merchandising advance: $20,000) (Manager's cut: $3,000) (Lawyer's fee: $1,000)
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(Publishing advance: $20,000) (Manager's cut: $3,000) (Lawyer's fee: $1,000)
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(Record sales: 250,000 @ $12 = $3,000,000 gross retail revenue Royalty (13% of 90%): $351,000 )
(Less advance: $250,000)(Producer's points: (3% less $50,000 advance) $40,000)
(Promotional budget: $25,000) (Recoupable buyout from previous label: $50,000)
(Net royalty: -$14,000)
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Record company income.
Record wholesale price $6.50 x 250,000 = $1,625,000 gross income
Artist Royalties: $351,000
Deficit from royalties: $14,000
Manufacturing, packaging and distribution @ $2.20 per record: $550,000
Gross profit: $710,000

The Balance Sheet: This is how much each player got paid at the end of the game.
Record company: $710,000
Producer: $90,000
Manager: $51,000
Studio: $52,500
Previous label: $50,000
Agent: $7,500
Lawyer: $12,000

Band member net income each: $4,031.25

[Shannon]

graemlins/jpshakehead.gif and everybody tries to get signed to a major label. I hope this wake some of them up..

[mdpm99]

Originally posted by Shannon:
graemlins/jpshakehead.gif and everybody tries to get signed to a major label. I hope this wake some of them up.. Greetings Shannon:

I will be in all day & eve.....just in case.

d

[Linedog]

This is a shame. The Major lables don't educate the talent and they take advantage of their ignorance.
This should Highlight maybe a few key lessons.
Know what your signing, take care of everything yourself,
make due with what you have, remove the word fancy from your vocabulary. In a sentence "Take only what you need, need only what you take" I mean that if you hammer out a good deal watch out for all those extras.

[mdpm99]

Originally posted by Linedog:
This is a shame. The Major lables don't educate the talent and they take advantage of their ignorance.
This should Highlight maybe a few key lessons.
Know what your signing, take care of everything yourself,
make due with what you have, remove the word fancy from your vocabulary. In a sentence "Take only what you need, need only what you take" I mean that if you hammer out a good deal watch out for all those extras. to Linedog:

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d

[AD]

graemlins/scared.gif

[blackwax]

this is exactly why prince takes care of all these things himself and sells his music over the internet.
he has full control over every aspect of his music

[bigg donn a.k.a bigg donn]

And the look on the artist face..........PRICELESS graemlins/scared.gif

[kev]

Did any of you read "Kind of Blue: The Making of the Miles Davis Masterpiece"? If memory serves me correct I think Mr. Davis got paid something like 50 bucks for that session.

[Linedog]

Originally posted by kevin koga:
Did any of you read "Kind of Blue: The Making of the Miles Davis Masterpiece"? If memory serves me correct I think Mr. Davis got paid something like 50 bucks for that session. Damn Shame graemlins/nono.gif

[kev]

You always hear people in Hip Hop comparing the recording industry to the pimp and ho industry. The record labels are the pimps and the artists are the hos.

[Monny JcIntosh]

David, do you know if this was from a Steve Albini interview? I think I read it a while back. He has some on point things to say about labels and their underhand dealings with artists. There was a great expose of A&R men, and advance contracts. I'll see if I can dig out the link.

[mdpm99]

Originally posted by kevin koga:
You always hear people in Hip Hop comparing the recording industry to the pimp and ho industry. The record labels are the pimps and the artists are the hos. Greetings Kevin:

re post:

"The music business is a cruel and shallow money trench,

A long plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free,

And good men die like dogs.

There's also a negative side."

--Hunter S. Thompson

[mdpm99]

Originally posted by Jonny McIntosh:
David, do you know if this was from a Steve Albini interview? I think I read it a while back. He has some on point things to say about labels and their underhand dealings with artists. There was a great expose of A&R men, and advance contracts. I'll see if I can dig out the link. Greetings Jonny:

It is an "excerpt" which I came across. I will dig back to see if I can re-locate it and if so I will post it.

d

[kev]

Originally posted by david mancuso:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by kevin koga:
You always hear people in Hip Hop comparing the recording industry to the pimp and ho industry. The record labels are the pimps and the artists are the hos. Greetings Kevin:

re post:

"The music business is a cruel and shallow money trench,

A long plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free,

And good men die like dogs.

There's also a negative side."

--Hunter S. Thompson </font>[/QUOTE]graemlins/rofl.gif

[El Mayimbe]

great post David,
funny thing is how on MTV they had several shows pointing this out. Now we all know the young kids watch MTV specials religiously and their favorite artists talk about how once you get signed by the majors the "Bling Blinging" doent really occur overnight. (speaking of that the riduculous amount of $$ spent by Hip-Hop artist who dont earn jackshit just makes me bang my head on the set in disgust)
When they point out everything you David mentioned the kids STILL STAND ONLINE FOR A SHOT OF MAKING THEMSELVES FOOLISH ON NATIONAL TV on shows like "American Idol".
hmmm call me an amatuer psychiatrist BUT maybe its the lack of attention these kids get @home that drive them to crave for Fame. graemlins/acclaim.gif

[Monny JcIntosh]

Originally posted by david mancuso:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by kevin koga:
You always hear people in Hip Hop comparing the recording industry to the pimp and ho industry. The record labels are the pimps and the artists are the hos. Greetings Kevin:

re post:

"The music business is a cruel and shallow money trench,

A long plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free,

And good men die like dogs.

There's also a negative side."

--Hunter S. Thompson </font>[/QUOTE]Haha, check the opening thoughts of Albini. Quite similar ;)

http://www.negativland.com/albini.html

[FK]

Hello David,

Just playing Devil's Advocate, but I think that the (well-known among music biz insiders) article you quote is somewhat flawed, or at the very least seriously out of date. It might have been more relevant in 1988...

I SERIOUSLY CAN'T BELIEVE THAT EVERYONE IS JUST TAKING THS WHOLE THING IN STRIDE WITHOUT EVEN QUESTIONING SOME OF THE DETAILS WRITTEN IN THERE. (might it be the same with our Federal Government's budget?...topic for another thread)

Some points for you to consider:

-1) These days people go into an album recording situation in a completely different manner than what this describes. That budget is totally overblown, and in all fairness, the band could probably get their record done in about 1/4 of the costs described. Only a platinum-selling act would indulge in this kind of audio smorgasbord. I find it quite funny that no one is questioning this, as it show a good way to put a smokescreen in front of anyone's eyes.

-2) Again, these figures apply VERY SPECIFICALLY to your average run-of-the-mill alternative rock garage band that gets signed by major label A&R man because they wrote one good song. Try applying the same mathematics to a Hip Hop recording budget and you will come up with a completely different set of math results.

-3) Speaking of ENTITLEMENT, I really do not understand why everyone feels that it's OK for people in the entertainment industry to cluelessly live like kings, and expect roast turkeys to fall from the sky with all the trimmings neatly packaged. Again, the document describes a bunch of total morons without any business acumen getting taken in by managers, lawyers,accountants...It is totally within musicians' (and any other performers', including DJs) rights to pick carefully who manages them, and retain control over their business dealings. And if they don't, why blame everyone else for their lack of sense?.... I mean, come on, if you want to start ANY OTHER KIND OF BUSINESS, like a deli or a store, you're expected to have a business plan, investors, etc. Please, someone tell me, what is so special about having a rock band with two average good songs? Kind of reminds me of these programs on late VH1 (where are they now) where you endlessly watch those poor rock stars enduring the agony of having coke-crazed sex orgies in the limo's jacuzzi and wondering where it all went wrong. AND YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO BE FEELING SORRY FOR THEM...

-4) There are plenty of openings for full-time positions with medical benefits and retirement plans for people whose sole purpose in life is have a couple of minutes of fame and glory with music. (once the couple of minutes are over, they'll have a lifetime to think about what went wrong and wh they can blame). That will leave the field open to the others who COUNTLESS TIMES have taken the same budget you describe, lived and recorded well within their means and SAVED or INVESTED some of it for a rainy day, and are still making a living full-time with music.

-5) Even in the worst-case-scenario of the above post actually applying to your situation, if you want to remain in the music biz you should try writing good songs; they will bring you plenty of income for many years; if that's not your bag, you could be producing other bands if yours is not doing so good; you should also have your own home studio, learn to operate most its gear and control your recording destiny; if none of the above works, you could become a DJ, touring expenses are very low and income after expenses much higher; you might even consider a 101 refresher course in economics (optional) and a lifetime membership to the Reality Check Club™. :D

Comments, replies, flames, please fire away!....

FK

[TAD]

i guess that shut everyone up real quick :D

thanks FK

[Monny JcIntosh]

The full article, and context for those figures, is found here:

http://www.negativland.com/albini.html

[FK]

Originally posted by Cosmic_Twin:
i guess that shut everyone up real quick :D Well, actually the point was more wondering why none of this was really read carefully rather than glanced at.... again, it brings frightening parallels with other budgets we may just be glancing at!! graemlins/scared.gif

Also, someone's opinions posted on the Net does not always authoritative knowledge make?

[TAD]

Originally posted by FK:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Cosmic_Twin:
i guess that shut everyone up real quick :D Well, actually the point was more wondering why none of this was really read carefully rather than glanced at.... again, it brings frightening parallels with other budgets we may just be glancing at!! graemlins/scared.gif

Also, someone's opinions posted on the Net does not always authoritative knowledge make? </font>[/QUOTE]some things are taken as gospel despite the obvious inaccuracies. sometimes personal feelings towards a specific issue usually warrant a knee jerk response, but alas this is human nature. it's comforting to know their will always be people to enlighten those who may not see the full picture.

[FK]

Originally posted by Cosmic_Twin: it's comforting to know their will always be people to enlighten those who may not see the full picture. Regarding my previous post, it was just personal views without any claim to (!)enlightening anyone, although I may have an opinion on the subject I am not a total expert at major label recording budgets and live band management.

So, rather than 'the full picture' let's just call it a 'second opinion' that might make for a livelier debate ? :D

FK

[Moksha]

FK--

I had the same thoughts reading this. It also fails to take a lot of other possible income the artists are able to make with a deal (i.e. endorsements, revenue from live dates, etc.) Furthermore, the article fails to recognize the fact that many albums cause the label to LOSE money. Marketing ain't cheap!

It's also impotant to note that every record contract is different. The artist is responsible for negotiating a deal that serves his/her interests. If they do not like the deal the label offers, they can take their business elsewhere.

Constantly painting artists as helpless vicitms presents an inaccurate picture.

[Jolyon]

Can I throw this into the mix:

I know a member of a very famous pop band here in Britain. The band split up recently. This band had numerous number one singles, sold millions of albums and were touring all around the world. This all over the course of about 4 years. They were signed to one of the major labels and their management was one of the biggest in the UK.

Of course, the band did not write many of their hits themselves, but still, this band member worked out that s/he earned less than half a million pounds from the band - at the most. S/he had maybe 10 days off in 4 years...every day was work, work, promote, promote, tour, tour, interviews, tv etc. etc. This band member is suffering from exhaustion and is old beyond their years. S/he knows that half a million is a lot of money, but it's perhaps not as much as you would expect.

It's estimated that the band's manager has earned over £20 million from the success of the band. Remember this was a band signed to a major, major label and managed by one of the most successful management companies in the world.

Just adding in this to the mix.

[Jolyon]

P.S. I should add that this amount includes endorsements and touring.

[domodisco]

I have a friend in a fairly successful band as well - two platinum records, MTV exposure, radio play, worldwide tours, etc. He is the main or sole writer of most of his songs. He figured that in his best year, after all of the monies were paid out, that he made a little more than his dentist! Then there are the years where he made almost nothing (in between albums and tours)...

[Moksha]

On the other hand, there are artists who take home millions for a single hit song. (I can think of a few.) And, there are artists who take home huge advances, then cause labels to lose millions. (I can think of a few.)

Every situation is different. It's all about that contract. . .

[TAD]

Originally posted by FK:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Cosmic_Twin: it's comforting to know their will always be people to enlighten those who may not see the full picture. Regarding my previous post, it was just personal views without any claim to (!)enlightening anyone, although I may have an opinion on the subject I am not a total expert at major label recording budgets and live band management.

So, rather than 'the full picture' let's just call it a 'second opinion' that might make for a livelier debate ? :D

FK </font>[/QUOTE]well you certainly "enlightened" me on a couple of things and thanks for your candor. smile.gif

[Pete Nice]

you're an up and coming artist.... you don't want to go broke and be on vh1as a has been: don't spend more than you make. don't live beyond your means. i remember ice-t making reference to this topic in a song he wrote and his book. something to the effect that even if you go gold or platinum you're still broke and hope you don't get sued. bling bling is a b.s. dream. you need smarter artist, but may be that's why they are artist and not managment.

[Digiman]

Originally posted by Jolyon:
Can I throw this into the mix:

I know a member of a very famous pop band here in Britain. The band split up recently. This band had numerous number one singles, sold millions of albums and were touring all around the world. This all over the course of about 4 years. They were signed to one of the major labels and their management was one of the biggest in the UK.

Of course, the band did not write many of their hits themselves, but still, this band member worked out that s/he earned less than half a million pounds from the band - at the most. S/he had maybe 10 days off in 4 years...every day was work, work, promote, promote, tour, tour, interviews, tv etc. etc. This band member is suffering from exhaustion and is old beyond their years. S/he knows that half a million is a lot of money, but it's perhaps not as much as you would expect.

It's estimated that the band's manager has earned over £20 million from the success of the band. Remember this was a band signed to a major, major label and managed by one of the most successful management companies in the world.

Just adding in this to the mix. Jolyon, that sounds to me like S Club 7 and Simon Fuller! smile.gif

[Jolyon]

graemlins/cool_shades.gif

[Digiman]

Originally posted by Jolyon:
graemlins/cool_shades.gif Tell Rachel and Tina I'm asking for them.
:D :D

[Jolyon]

graemlins/bolt.gif

[Linedog]

My post was, that no matter what the figures are you need to watch the bottom line, period. You don't figure, that the very same people that have a handle on the purse strings, are not going to watch their bottom line? I don't see any record deals being made on a handshake... graemlins/scared.gif

[mdpm99]

Originally posted by Jonny McIntosh:
The full article, and context for those figures, is found here:

http://www.negativland.com/albini.html Greetings again Jonny:

Thank you for finding the complete info. I did not see the original beginning ...where I found the info I posted.

Good l@@ing out!

graemlins/thumbsup.gif

d


Ps. All n' all I would like to add that "we have together" developed a stimulating and interesting thread.

Thank you - d.

[ June 30, 2003, 03:28 PM: Message edited by: david mancuso ]

[kev]

An exerpt from

"The Music Biz.. Are Industry People Shady"

written by Dave'Davey D' Cook


"The saddest story, I ever heard regarding this recently occurred when old school artist Barry B-Stro of the pioneering group the Crash Crew, explained how his group was forever in the red during their brief stay on Sugar Hill Records. He spoke about how there was always some sort of hidden 'promotion' expense that was levied against them...preventing them from getting paid in full."

[mdpm99]

Footnote:

Practice random kindness and senseless acts of beauty....

smile.gif

d

[alex zen]

[ June 30, 2003, 09:33 PM: Message edited by: alex zen ]

[DOTSmusic]

this kinda ties in with this subject.

Interview with Anton Newcombe from the band The Brian Jonestown Masacre in Vendetta Mag, 12/00, by Ben Vendetta

Ben: The thing I wanted to talk about most, at least at the beginning, is your contract dispute with TVT. Could you give some background on your contract and why you're having problems now?

Anton: It's kind of interesting because the way I see it is a label is set up so you have a person who's a visionary of a label. Frank Sinatra started Reprise Records. Of course he didn't run it so he didn't have business affairs. Frank probably wasn't interested in even having the label after a while. He was more interested in getting away from Capitol at the beginning so in the meantime there comes a Board of Directors. My label in America is TVT and it was sort of acquired by a lawyer--according to my information--who kind of fought a lawsuit on behalf of somebody who owned the label. It was called Television Tunes and the guy said you know, basically, these people are making CDs of a song I wrote for a TV series I wrote and I want to sue them because they're not paying me enough so the lawyer goes "How much do you want?" He said, "O.k., we'll get that."

He went to go sue them and ended up owning the label and just paid the guy the money. He like literally sued the shit out of them. He started doing television reissues. They've been doing all kinds of stuff. They've got Snoop Dogg, they've got Sevendust, XTC, Guided By Voices, Gil Scott-Heron; they acquired Wax Trax, numerous things. They've got their own trip and it just changes every day They're pretty much the new major label. They have their own distribution network and they continue to go worldwide. They have offices and distribution networks everywhere.

The owner of the label, Mr. Gottlieb, Steve, it got to the point through his A&R guy, which is my A&R guy Adam Shore, young guy who's cool. You know, I made CD-R's and showed him all the stuff that I had done. Took it out of context, and Gottlieb said "look, you've got to get these guys." I was kind of rude to him and all that stuff. I kind of blew him off like everyone else I met when labels started to get really interested. I eventually called him back and it was kind of like I remember sleeping in Oklahoma on somebody's couch and I got this call in the middle of the morning and the owner of the label said, "I'd really like to want to talk to you. I'd like to come out and see you." I go, "Unfortunately, I have other commitments, let me check my calendar and we can set up a time. Is June 7, 2000 o.k?" This was like three years in the past. That's what I said to him basically and he said, "I'm sitting out here in The Hamptons and I'm listening to some of your records right now and I'm really digging this stuff and I'd really like to sign your band." So I said, "That's possible. I'll have my people talk to you."

So, basically, he gave the Business Affairs the o.k. to sign the band within reason. Well, the Business Affairs knew my lawyer so it was a kind of situation where they were already friends and they set up this contract and we just went through it clause by clause. I don't think they even got a chance to offer us something. We just kind of went down and made a contract and it was signed. My lawyer went through it clause by clause. He's an entertainment lawyer, Barry Simons, and he's been my really good friend for a long time. He's really supported me for almost the whole history of the band and he said "this is not unreasonable." He brokers deals all the time for bands and so that's cool. And the guy (TVT lawyer) just said, "Yes, yes, yes" down the line and we just put in everything in one thing by one thing and they okayed it and they signed the contract. It's all worded when you read it so that a layman would think it was written for TVT but it's just like pointing out their rights. Within the realm of that, it's all about my rights. Do you understand? Instead of talking about me, like I need this or I need that, it's all this is what he can do.

We kind of tricked them in a way because they ended up firing the Business Affairs guy. It's insane; nobody has a contract like that. In my contract they had to exercise the rights. Like they set down budgets. I am the producer. Normally what happens is Butch Vigg or Steve Albini or whoever get assigned to band-of-the-week or whatever. You work out all the details and get a recording budget. Everybody knows the story. The producer gets like 60 or 100,000 dollars. You probably get about $125,000 for the recording if you get a real record deal and not a demo deal. The producer gets at least $60,000 for recording it and everybody buys instruments and there's all this shit that has to happen and that money is gone. I'm the producer so I get that money and there's nothing they can say about that.

Ben: So as far as contracts go, you have as much complete control as possible?

Anton: Yeah, because you can argue with the producer and they can argue with the artist but it's still the same person and the first thing I did was make them sign a contract to say they're not allowed to do business with me. They're not allowed to talk business with me. It doesn't say that I can't tell them what I'm going to do. It says that they are technically not allowed to discuss business with me.

Ben: So they go through your lawyer to talk to you?

Anton: It doesn't really specify that. It just says that they're not allowed to talk to me or one of my friends.That's all. They're not allowed to discuss business with me. It's not appropriate. An artist who represents himself has an idiot for a representative and that's how I explained it. I'm not interested in that. It doesn't really matter if I am absolutely interested in that. The matter is the perception. People could just get off on a tangent on something like, you should focus on this or you should focus on that. It just makes it easier. The other thing I did that is kind of interesting is that I encouraged my A&R guy to get a two-year contract with this label so he could not get fired as a part of the deal. The whole thing about that is your A&R guy is somebody else's nightmare because most people who know what's going to catch on and how big for the amount of an investment? They put real money into our band but unfortunately they can pay people like Sevendust $60,000 for masters that already exist to sign them to a deal and they're ****ed. They're just ****ed. They're selling 800,000 copies and they [the label] are making pure money. I would venture that, realistically, those guys haven't made a penny except for playing. It's pure money but it's not going to the artist.

I was like I'm not expecting to ever make a penny but my label has to pay for everything. The way I look at it is that when people sell their labels-and eventually they will because an individual owns this label and labels are sold. Even Seagrams buys other people's labels. People with great visions get out of it. All of these companies are started by individuals and they're turned into conglomerates and then it's just a catalog. The label is deactivated. Columbia becomes Sony and 550 or whatever the **** they're called. The whole point is that certain artists become important for the catalog. Leonard Cohen is important to the Columbia catalog. It doesn't matter if he was critically acclaimed in the 60's because those magazines aren't available except at garage sales or weird shops or on Ebay. The artists who make good records become an asset to a catalog. I guess what I'm getting at is New Kids On The Block sold millions of records but nobody in the world goes in and buys a New Kids On The Block album today. It's completely meaningless and worthless as a back catalog. People don't understand that The Doors didn't sell more than a couple hundred thousand copies when they were number one in the 60's. They went over Platinum in the 80's and sold millions of copies. It had already been recouped and written off. It was just pure capitol when they repackaged that shit. They actually became popular in the 80's. They were insignificant as far as money goes in the 60's. Elektra was making money and growing but the value of money changed over time and the value of the business changed and they became significant in the 80's. They were insignificant in the 60's even if they were number one. You have to remember who all the number ones were. They were just faceless masses.

Anyways, back to my contract, as it turns out I believe that my label is in material breach of my contract and we're just working on that. It got complicated. They fired the Business Affairs guy when they figured out what my contract actually was. The reality of the situation when it really sunk in was kind of like any other label. They developed a little bit of apathy. The problem is one of the clauses in the contract is that they had to notify me if they were going to exercise the second option on every album. If I put out an album six months later, they have to start paying me for the next one or I'm released from my contract. They notified me as far as paying me money but I told them that I was going to take a year or so to record the record. I did what I said I was going to do and they started freaking. The point I'm trying to make is that it's not going to reflect on me. Nobody's going to say, "Oh my God, Anton's lost his ****ing mind. Oh my God, these guys are raving lunatics. They're so unprofessional." They're going to say, "You guys are ****ing idiots for signing that contract and giving him everything." That's the coolest thing about it. It doesn't reflect on me whatsoever. It reflects on them and the best thing they can do is we're resolving it but unfortunately it takes a lot of time. It doesn't deter me. I bought my recording studio with the money that the industry throws at bands. I didn't go out and buy a Porsche. I couldn't give a **** what they do. I'm not Cheap Trick and I'm not chained to those things. I like producing bands. I did the Smallstone record in my studio and I make other things happen. I don't care. My band is not that important but my freedom is.

Ben: So, basically, you can't put out Bravery, Repetition and Noise until this gets resolved?

Anton: No, basically, I can put out EPs and do all kinds of other things. The thing is I am hoping to resolve this because when I work on a team with somebody, I want our team to succeed. I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt. Ultimately, what could happen is I could sue them, take the money, not give them songs or the masters, and as a settlement for the hassles, get off the label. I just choose not to do that right now. I'm giving them every opportunity in good confidence that they won't be stupid idiots. Ultimately, I do not ****ing care. The thing is I cannot be sued because I technically don't even have a home. I have nothing. It's all them. It's all completely on them.

Ben: I think the frustrating thing is for the fans who just want to hear the music.

Anton: I just played you a song.

Ben: Of course, but not everyone has that kind of access.

Anton: I can do other things too. I'm not a typical powerless person. My label does not get me laid, my label does not feed me, my label does not provide anything for me. What they do is manufacture and distribute records. Well, if you really wanted to put out records and you had a desire to do that, then that could be a problem if that was withheld from you. I have a tremendous back catalog and I have my own labels and I have the Internet and I have extensive mail order and pen pal and email connections with people so they have nothing. I could get it out to as many people as they could quicker. They would have to use my talents to get it out as quick. I don't care. I can share music. I'm technically not doing anything wrong by sharing music. There's nothing in my contract that says I can't give away music. I'm not asking to sue the world for their desire to appreciate art. I'm not asking to sit around like some old **** in Sweden like Lee Hazelwood and have everyone pay my way everywhere, all the time. It would be nice if I could do a few simple things and be compensated by that. I wish everybody wasn't like I had a great manager for a while. He would have been the greatest person to deal with because of his personality. Unfortunately, he got greedy. He had the easiest job in the world. I did all the work. All you had to do was have the "Hi, I'm a fat ****" attitude. He didn't have to do anything else besides that but unfortunately, people get greedy whether they're lawyers, record companies, or people. Who am I to think that I'm the one who can do this? It's never been done. Everybody gets caught up in weird shit. This isn't stopping me from anything. I'm just working on other stuff.

Ben: It's obvious that you spent a lot of time working on the songs that you just played us.

Anton: This is like much more important than the whole contract shit. What's really important to me is the fact that I'm going to be 33 on August 29 and my music and my desire to do things or any of it has nothing to do with my age. It's not like it's getting worse or anything. I'm getting more focus. That's cool because you don't know. You think a lot of things and you kind of cling to them. You could get in your first relationship and you could say, "I don't like you going out. I don't like you looking at boys. I don't want you to do this" because you think it's all going to go away. That's the way you lose everything because you cease to exist. You cease to being in the moment because you have all your fears. I don't have that and I'm happy these days because of it.

Ben: There seems to be a really good scene in Los Angeles at the moment with bands like you, Beachwood Sparks, Smallstone, and Black Rebel Motorcycle Club. One thing that impresses me is how everyone seems to be friendly and supportive of each other instead of being competitive. I was wondering what your thoughts were on the subject?

Anton: I can't be in competition with anybody. I really can't. I can't be afraid of what other people are doing. I like people that are likeable. If you want self esteem, you have to do things that give you esteem. To the change the world you have to actually change the world. I can't really speak readily for how anybody else feels about anything. I'm just not in competition with anybody and I'll do anything for anybody who is worth helping. I would do nothing for my enemies. They'll destroy themselves. From my spiritual beliefs, I know for a fact that anybody who has opposed me on a gut level for some stupid reason will destroy themselves because they're not focused. They're worried about other people. They're not concentrating on themselves or their art or their gift or making people happy. They're worried about whatever they're worried about. They're not focused. At this point in life, it's important for me to be focused.

Ben: You mentioned on some of your emails to the Brian Jonestown Massacre list that you were working on a Pet Sounds-type of record but then you decided to make a more rock `n' roll record. Some of the stuff you were just playing us seemed to be more trippy and mellow so where are you at in terms of the vision for the new album?

Anton: I am writing songs from my heart. One of my EPs I want to call 20th Century Rock. Too many people say, "You just wish you were from the 60's, man." I am from the 60's so they can't say anything about that, really, people say a lot of things. They never shut up. The thing is I thought it would be funny to call a record 20th Century Rock. I can tell people that it's not 60's music; it's 20th century rock! I thought it would be cool to put out a record of really cool stuff and call it 20th Century Rock so I'm copywriting and trademarking it, so **** all you guys! I also want to do an EP where I cover the Ride song "Vapour Trail" with Miranda [Lee Richards]. Instead of a poncey guy from Oxford with a bad attitude and a bit of a lisp, I have the most beautiful girl singing the song. Those are the words you want to hear from a girl. Any woman would listen to that and say, "That's how I feel." Any man would go, "Wow, she's singing to me." It just completely opens it up to the whole world by changing the gender. I've always been interested in that, now I'm realizing it more. I thought Bravery, Repetition and Noise, like what am I about when I started working on it, that's rock `n' roll so I'm going to stick with that. I always wanted to do harmonics. I've always done that with instruments because a lot of my peers at the time either didn't know the significance of what I was trying to accomplish or what we were doing. It was more, "What are we doing tomorrow, what are we doing tonight." I've always wanted to do harmonies so now I'm using girls and other guys and just doing it.

Ben: So your immediate priority is to get around TVT then is to release EPs on your own?

Anton: It's not to get around. It's to work until they decide they don't want to work anymore. I want to avoid some situation where out of business spite, someone says nobody in the world can hear what this person is doing. I'll go tour in Italy and let everyone record it. There are no copyright laws and they can export it and do what they want. I'll go play as myself. I don't care. The bottom line is I love to play music. I just have to have faith. My relationship with my lawyer is tight. The business is second place. He loves the music as much as you do. Not everybody is going to be that way. Not everybody wants friendship.

Ben: Who's in the Brian Jonestown Massacre these days, like for your live shows?

Anton: Joel's coming up to play some more shows. Matt's living up in Portland. Dean and Jeff are living in L.A. Jeff's in smallstone, Dean's going to real estate school. Those guys are just people. I'm just playing with people. It's the same thing I've always been doing. Not everyone who plays music would even want to do what occurs to me as my inspiration. Not everyone wants to live a Spartan life like I do. I take the responsibilities. Weird shit happens. Sometimes people hop up and try to completely ****ing kill me over singing love songs and that's just bullshit. I would just be content with playing songs.

Ben: It's obvious that that's what you're about so I just hope everything works out well for you.

Anton: I'm not worried about it because people are trying to kill love everyday. Somebody's fighting someone somewhere and they're killing people's kids everyday. All the love, all the time: breast-feeding, labor pains, schooling, education, every hot cooked meal for that kid, dead. It's really insignificant if somebody calls me a fag or something because I'm trying to sing a love song. I know that I cannot be defeated. I'm not going to get killed for singing a love song. That's not going to happen. Natural predators only prey on the weak and I'm not weak. I do care if people throw bottles and shit, that's bullshit. I have very sophisticated ways of dealing with that stuff but it's going to get increasingly severe.

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[ June 30, 2003, 10:38 PM: Message edited by: aKiLa ]

[DOTSmusic]

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graemlins/beerchug.gif

[mdpm99]

Originally posted by aKiLa:
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graemlins/beerchug.gif My graemlins/respekt.gif to you aKiLa.

d

We are born naked, wet and hungry. Then things get worse. smile.gif

[ July 01, 2003, 09:54 PM: Message edited by: david mancuso ]