Arrangement

[blackwax]

Your thoughts and processes

I know everyone works differently but I will ask anyway
I often come up with ideas on a track and get about 8 bars in
At this point I struggle to arrange the track. All the instruments and parts I need are in place but find it difficult to make it into a complete track with peaks energy etc
How do you approach this?

[SoundScience]

Your thoughts and processes

I know everyone works differently but I will ask anyway
I often come up with ideas on a track and get about 8 bars in
At this point I struggle to arrange the track. All the instruments and parts I need are in place but find it difficult to make it into a complete track with peaks energy etc
How do you approach this?

I have two approaches..

1st one is to work in 16 bar increments..adding and subtracting elements...if there is something going on at 33-49 I may call that A and return to that same arrangement at bar 105..and what happens at 49-65 may come back at 115 or so..

the other is to take tracks by artists I enjoy and drag them into my logic project..My project will become the tempo of that track..and I will add markers where changes take place in that track..I make specific notes like cymbal crash ,synth lead, break down, etc and go from there..

[Ashwell]

Good subject Blackwax.

I like building up all of the parts (at least the core ones) and then just playing the mix throughout the five or six minutes, or whatever it is, on a mixing board, bringing in parts and taking them out as it feels right. Hardware makes this a lot easier and more fun for me but you could get that with midi controllers. Anyway, this gives me a good sense of what needs to happen and when. Then I can go back and make changes or build on things.

I also like to finish a song in one DAW like Cubase and then bounce everything to stems and bring it into Ableton where I can play around with different arrangement ideas and easily add or subtract parts. I'm still not sold on using Ableton for everything but it does seem to be the best tool for getting arrangement ideas, especially when using an apc40.

The other thing I've been playing with is just doing it the old fashioned way by using a keyboard and staff paper to get a sense of the whole thing before I even turn on the computer.

But yeah, I'm interested to hear what other people say. I feel like I'm constantly struggling with this one.

[Marshall Jefferson]

Pretty much I do the same thing Soundscience does except for dropping other artists into my Logic project. It's always been very mathematical with me since the beginning, when I would make 8 and 16 measure sections. You also want to have a section or two where you drop everything except one instrument, or change everything completely for impact. and having multiple drum patterns helps a lot too. Finally, the best ingredient is a shit hot vocalist, he/she can inspire you to do some wild things behind them.

[mocilo74]

Ok, here is what I do lately. After I stopped using most of the time synced features inside my DAW and started working with Hz / kHz values instead I try to go on for a more organic sound.

I map all my important knobs and faders via midi to my controller and start jamming - solo, mute, bypass, filter, resonance, enable, disable, high, low... etc. (and recording the midi data of course). After that I start reviewing and finetuning, cutting and editing that shit. Most of the time it works very well. Jamming around for 15 minutes - 1 hour gives me more ideas and examples about combinations of tracks that I could use in my final arrangement. :)

And listening to all my favorite records off course and try to indentify "their arrangements" (mostly classic shit like 80s/90s chicago & detroit stuff, garage and disco, old jazz and soul records).


Cheers,
mocilo74

And thx Marshall for all your tips and tricks and the basic and advanced techniques you teach us here in the producers section. I appreciate that.

[blackwax]

Thanks for the reply
The 1st point sounds a little clinical for me
Have used the 2nd point myself a few times

What other tricks do people use for energy drama etc
Such as automation or drum fills etc?

[Ashwell]

This thread reminded me of an old article that might be worth looking at it.

http://www.musicradar.com/tuition/tech/14-ways-to-create-a-great-song-arrangement-183143

[blackwax]

strange I thought I was the 1st to reply posts seem in a different order now LOL

Thanks to all that have replied so far
Certainly food for thought

[Nightshade]

The other is to take tracks by artists I enjoy and drag them into my logic project..My project will become the tempo of that track..and I will add markers where changes take place in that track..I make specific notes like cymbal crash ,synth lead, break down, etc and go from there..

This seems like a really great idea but every time I start arranging a track, I just go with the flow. I want to use this technique but I find it hard to get a track with the same feel.

I haven't got a grip on arranging, I just do it because it needs to get done, but You guys are sharing some really great tips, much appreciated :) Looking forward for more. I just hope someone will talk about crescendos and tricks you use for energy.

[blackwax]

This thread reminded me of an old article that might be worth looking at it.

http://www.musicradar.com/tuition/tech/14-ways-to-create-a-great-song-arrangement-183143

found this link from the one above :-)

http://www.musicradar.com/tuition/tech/creating-a-club-track-10-mix-and-arrangement-tips-175793

[Ashwell]

found this link from the one above :-)

http://www.musicradar.com/tuition/tech/creating-a-club-track-10-mix-and-arrangement-tips-175793

Lot of good info in there.