The Matrix Reloaded [SPOILER THREAD - dont look b4 u see the movie!!!]

[The Good Reverend Rollo Goodlove]

Originally posted by Nicholas:
I also love the bit where Agent Smith cuts off Neo's hand and then tells him he's his father.

[img]graemlins/lol.gif[/img] [img]hail.gif[/img]

[The Good Reverend Rollo Goodlove]

Originally posted by serge:
you know what i thought was wack in this movie?

the scene where persephone makes neo bust a mack on her

i music for the rally/dance/sex scene was weak as hell (they shoulda put on "the perculator")

the morpheus speech was weak (they bit that shit off of weak ass "independence day)

and again...

why does a WASP American Male always gotta be the savior of humanity? why not a MAC (Mexican American Catholic) Male (like myself) or an AAB Female (Asian American Buddhist), or a AAB-Bi Female(African American Baptist)!

DAMN!

Actually serge Will smith was originally asked to play Neo buit turned the part down.

[Bold Soul]

Keanu Reeves is Hawaiian, Chinese and English.

Doesn't classify him was WASP at all.

[ May 17, 2003, 11:46 AM: Message edited by: Bold Soul ]

[Bold Soul]

Originally posted by liL Ray:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Bold Soul:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by serge:
i wanna bring persephone to cataclysmic orgasm.

Man, was Monica Bellucci workin' that dress or what. Ugh... </font>[/QUOTE]That dress was banging!!! Anybody know who made it...was it made by the Baroness...www.baroness.com ??

Great discussion by the way...I thought the music for the Zion party was Slamming! Didn't the the party animal in you wish you were at that party?

I love the Oracle...so real, if you know what I'm saying. </font>[/QUOTE]Oh, I know what you're saying. And those dresses at www.baroness.com are wicked, to say the least. I love her designs.

Whoa - this gives me an idea...Lil Ray, at it again. Can I call you Little Buddha?!

[liL Ray]

[quote]Originally posted by Bold Soul:

And those dresses at www.baroness.com are wicked, to say the least. I love her designs.

Whoa - this gives me an idea...Lil Ray, at it again. Can I call you Little Buddha?!

The Baroness is the bombdiggity...that's what the wife said...oops, I'm letting the fetishes out of the bag :D ....

What's the idea...spill the beans.

Oh, by the way, that car chase scene was out of this f'ing world!!! The best chase scene in a movie ever!!!!

[P-Flipp]

Anyone notice Cornel West's cameo?wow! ;)

[ May 18, 2003, 04:49 PM: Message edited by: P-Flipp ]

[Bold Soul]

Originally posted by liL Ray:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Bold Soul:

And those dresses at www.baroness.com are wicked, to say the least. I love her designs.

Whoa - this gives me an idea...Lil Ray, at it again. Can I call you Little Buddha?!

The Baroness is the bombdiggity...that's what the wife said...oops, I'm letting the fetishes out of the bag :D ....

What's the idea...spill the beans.

Oh, by the way, that car chase scene was out of this f'ing world!!! The best chase scene in a movie ever!!!! </font>

Oh yes! The carchase was worth the price of admission alone. Hot shit.

As far as my idea, PM me and I'll get down. Can't allow the unenightened to be privy. LOL!

[jsd540]

Originally posted by Nicholas:

I also dont think its a Matrix within a matrix as I was expounding above, i think that Rickey and Serge have the right idea.

I tend to believe the matrix within a matrix theory.

The architect mentioned that even though giving people a choice would lead to unlimited possibilities, in the end the anomoly would repeat itself and lead to only one result, the birth and continual re-birth of the one.

It would only be logical to create a "real world" for these anomolies to escape to, it would additionally keep them blind to the real fight.

[jsd540]

Originally posted by Nicholas:
I also love the bit where Agent Smith cuts off Neo's hand and then tells him he's his father.

[img]graemlins/rofl.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/rofl.gif[/img]

[Bill Blake]

Originally posted by serge:
you know what i thought was wack in this movie?

the scene where persephone makes neo bust a mack on her

i music for the rally/dance/sex scene was weak as hell (they shoulda put on "the perculator")

the morpheus speech was weak (they bit that shit off of weak ass "independence day)

and again...

why does a WASP American Male always gotta be the savior of humanity? why not a MAC (Mexican American Catholic) Male (like myself) or an AAB Female (Asian American Buddhist), or a AAB-Bi Female(African American Baptist)!

DAMN!

Well serge persephone shoule be with me but beside that, if I remember correctly Jet Li was the one the originally had in mind for Neo and he turned it down to his bullshit romeo must die crap movies.

I heard he turned down Crouching Tiger too, the guy if a real ****ing idiot...he must be really regreting some shit...which he should.

[Bill Blake]

Questions:

So not all 6 times in recreating the Matrix was there a ‘one’ that had a choice?

Giving everyone in the Matrix was given some volition (the main thing missing from the earlier ones that made them not work as well) is what created the possibility of anomalies because mathematically they could not predict all outcomes…

……So when they gave Neo the choice to save Zion or the girl (so is trinity the mother of the Matrix the architect was referring too? Cause there is not another female character that has been introduced thus far that could be considered?) Was it their calculation that he would save Zion instead (the decision that starts the whole process over) which is the choice that all the others had chosen before him? And him choosing the saving Trinity throws a real wrench in their control since it’s the choice none had taken yet (not going back with the Noah’s arch thing of a few humans and rebuilding)???????????

[Nicholas]

Originally posted by Jamie Lennox:
Questions:

So not all 6 times in recreating the Matrix was there a ‘one’ that had a choice?

Giving everyone in the Matrix was given some volition (the main thing missing from the earlier ones that made them not work as well) is what created the possibility of anomalies because mathematically they could not predict all outcomes…

……So when they gave Neo the choice to save Zion or the girl (so is trinity the mother of the Matrix the architect was referring too? Cause there is not another female character that has been introduced thus far that could be considered?) Was it their calculation that he would save Zion instead (the decision that starts the whole process over) which is the choice that all the others had chosen before him? And him choosing the saving Trinity throws a real wrench in their control since it’s the choice none had taken yet (not going back with the Noah’s arch thing of a few humans and rebuilding)???????????

definately on the last bit. they had constructed everything so he would pick the other door and 'save humanity' but Neo "understands something that the others did not" and picks the other door for two reasons

1) Trinity
2) He realises something else that we dont yet.

Oh and the mother of the matrix is THE ORACLE you idiot lennox! pay attention!

Oh and I read an interview where Keanu dismissed the matrix in a matrix theory - he said that the brothers dont play box within a box tricks on the audience.


I saw the film again and its clever, there are so many references to their being 6 Ones in the past.
Agent smith talks about the "others", The marovigiligilwillian says "the others had more respect than you". Also Persephone says that the Merovoginian used to be just like Neo (adding further credence to my theory he was a One once too).

[Bill Blake]

Originally posted by Nicholas:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Jamie Lennox:
Questions:

So not all 6 times in recreating the Matrix was there a ‘one’ that had a choice?

Giving everyone in the Matrix was given some volition (the main thing missing from the earlier ones that made them not work as well) is what created the possibility of anomalies because mathematically they could not predict all outcomes…

……So when they gave Neo the choice to save Zion or the girl (so is trinity the mother of the Matrix the architect was referring too? Cause there is not another female character that has been introduced thus far that could be considered?) Was it their calculation that he would save Zion instead (the decision that starts the whole process over) which is the choice that all the others had chosen before him? And him choosing the saving Trinity throws a real wrench in their control since it’s the choice none had taken yet (not going back with the Noah’s arch thing of a few humans and rebuilding)???????????

definately on the last bit. they had constructed everything so he would pick the other door and 'save humanity' but Neo "understands something that the others did not" and picks the other door for two reasons

1) Trinity
2) He realises something else that we dont yet.

Oh and the mother of the matrix is THE ORACLE you idiot lennox! pay attention!

Oh and I read an interview where Keanu dismissed the matrix in a matrix theory - he said that the brothers dont play box within a box tricks on the audience.


I saw the film again and its clever, there are so many references to their being 6 Ones in the past.
Agent smith talks about the "others", The marovigiligilwillian says "the others had more respect than you". Also Persephone says that the Merovoginian used to be just like Neo (adding further credence to my theory he was a One once too). </font>[/QUOTE]I thought the architect dismissed the Oracle being the mother?

Yea, I remember now that the guy had said he was different because his ‘memories’ were much more personal. And also that Neo seemed to understand that not everything like Morpheus and the computers was planned faith and that choice the important factor everyone was leaving out.

Ok so now….what the deal with him having ‘Matrix’ powers in the real world?

[Bold Soul]

Yea, I think the "Zion and Subsystem to the global Matrix" angle would be a cop-out in storytelling terms - unless it really made philosophical sense.

But the gist of what I received from the Architect's breakdown is that a bit of deterministic unpredictability was used to reinforce the code - and that code would have to be upgraded at the point when the Zion population reached 250,000.

This is why there was a sentinel for each and every human (Morpheus' comment - "that's exactly how a machine would think"). And the Architect comments wryly how they have "gotten really efficient at it".

I have a feeling that Revolutions is going to be a trip and a half - something really profound. I liked this joint - although from a cinematic POV, I was lost when Smith took over Bain's body. The shot of Neo waking up afterward, as if it was a dream, was misleading.

JLennie - you can tell they had to cut Reloaded together in a hurry. The cohesion in the edit was a bit choppy.

I really REALLY dug this joint. A LOTof value there.

[Nicholas]

Alright, the architect said becoming the one had changed him and clearly in the matrix neo is unstoppable. And dont forget how he got there - through enlightenment and getting smarter.
So maybe in the real world, he now has a connection with the machines.

All that happened was he sensed them coming and then caused them to have a massive electrical failure.

Why has he got a connection to the machines?

1) something he picked up for agent smith
2) [my theory] Neo is part machine.

[Bold Soul]

Originally posted by Nicholas:
Alright, the architect said becoming the one had changed him and clearly in the matrix neo is unstoppable. And dont forget how he got there - through enlightenment and getting smarter.
So maybe in the real world, he now has a connection with the machines.

All that happened was he sensed them coming and then caused them to have a massive electrical failure.

Why has he got a connection to the machines?

1) something he picked up for agent smith
2) [my theory] Neo is part machine.

Is it just me or hasn't a differential been tossed around in the dialog about "one BORN IN the Matrix"?

[Cordell]

Originally posted by kenspank:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by toomuchtv:
How about this, notice how the one dude got infected by Smith and tried to kill Neo on the outside which means that Smith's infection works in both the Matrix and the real world? Maybe, since Smith tried to infect Neo in the matrix, Neo also now has influence on both planes which is how he was able to stop the sentinels in the real world.

Did someone mention this already? If so, sorry. I probably didn't read enough.

yeah i noticed that when neo was able to stop those sentinels with his bare hands toward the end of the movie. </font>[/QUOTE]I was talking with my cousin about this to. This might be the difference with Neo being the One. I don't know about the other Ones, but Neo being able to use his Super Human powers in both the Matrix and the "real" world. This might be something that has never been done... and we might soon find out in 'Revolutions'

[Bill Blake]

The thing that didnt seem to make sense was the whole Smith thing in the way the film was edited, as if they had to force his importance on you.

Nor do I really understand what Smith is or what he wants in the sense that would going to the architect at that point given him the 'power' that they seem to be making him want?

Also is the Oracle pushing Neo towards the cycle again or is she aware or even want him to 'do it differently'?

I guess thats why she was in charge of all the potentials (makes sense) looking for the one to fullfil the cycle.

Ill tell you one thing, A lot of big time directors in Hollywood are nervous as ****....

I remeber 'Bullet' being the first old school revolutionary car chase....now, no one will be able to top the Matrix one for a long ****ing time....that shit was out of hand....they really outdid themselves.


Although I like the style of how the fight scenes were filmed in crouching tiger much better than matrix....meaning I think the matrix style is perfect for that movie but unlike the car chase which just took the damn cake...there are still some innovative or other methods for fight scenes that can work well.

[ May 19, 2003, 10:08 AM: Message edited by: Jamie Lennox ]

[Bill Blake]

Originally posted by Nicholas:
.

All that happened was he sensed them coming and then caused them to have a massive electrical failure.

Good point, it wasnt really 'matrix super powers' just his ability to stop the machines.

[Bill Blake]

Oh and ha ha ha at Cornell West being in the flick


Really sad note:

Gloria Foster, who played the wise and cryptic Oracle, passed away from complications of diabetes.

She had a really strong screne pressence.

[ May 19, 2003, 10:22 AM: Message edited by: Jamie Lennox ]

[Nicholas]

I looked at an old trailer for both the films and there was the voice of the merovergilian saying, obviously under duress "I would die for that man".

???? ooooooh, so exciting!!!???

[Oak Pk, IL's Best Bedroom DJ, serge]

Originally posted by Jamie Lennox:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by serge:
you know what i thought was wack in this movie?

the scene where persephone makes neo bust a mack on her

i music for the rally/dance/sex scene was weak as hell (they shoulda put on "the perculator")

the morpheus speech was weak (they bit that shit off of weak ass "independence day)

and again...

why does a WASP American Male always gotta be the savior of humanity? why not a MAC (Mexican American Catholic) Male (like myself) or an AAB Female (Asian American Buddhist), or a AAB-Bi Female(African American Baptist)!

DAMN!

Well serge persephone shoule be with me but beside that, if I remember correctly Jet Li was the one the originally had in mind for Neo and he turned it down to his bullshit romeo must die crap movies.

I heard he turned down Crouching Tiger too, the guy if a real ****ing idiot...he must be really regreting some shit...which he should. </font>[/QUOTE]Get off my woman, Jamie! [img]graemlins/cussing.gif[/img]

They should've asked me to play Neo. I would've told Morpheus, "Wait outside. I gotta take care of something". Then, I would've busted out a couple of slices of that Orgasm cake, fed it to Persephone and Trinity...

Man, if you think that car chase scene set a new precedent in action scenes, that bathroom scene woulda set a new standard in sci-fi love scenes! ;)

DAMN!

[MarkK]

You know that was a Paul Okenfold song for the zion rave?

Originally posted by kenspank:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by serge:
you know what i thought was wack in this movie?

the scene where persephone makes neo bust a mack on her

i music for the rally/dance/sex scene was weak as hell (they shoulda put on "the perculator")

the morpheus speech was weak (they bit that shit off of weak ass "independence day)

and again...

why does a WASP American Male always gotta be the savior of humanity? why not a MAC (Mexican American Catholic) Male (like myself) or an AAB Female (Asian American Buddhist), or a AAB-Bi Female(African American Baptist)!

DAMN!

at least house music isn't dead in zion.

they keep giving white men superhuman powers, but deep down inside they know that superman is really black. and it makes them mad. </font>[/QUOTE]

[Nicholas]

[Ligament]

I thought the soundtrack was crap.

Especially the choice of Paul freakin Oakenfold as the artist for the "rave scene"

Shit, they could have really made the scene so much better by putting some innovative, futuristic music in there, some juan atkins or jeff mills tracks...

Are we to believe people are still listening to crap oakenfold TRANCE in the future! kill me now!