The shit going on in Liberia....

[richierich]

What if anything should the U.S. do??? A lot of what goes on in Africa period is overlooked by the U.S....Rwanda, Congo, Zimbabwe, Sudan, Ethiopia, these places are going through a lot of turmoil and I was wondering .. does our government care?? Should they leave Africa alone or intervene? It hurts my own heart when I see the stuff going on over there.

[Koffy Brown]

I was just thinking about this yesterday...

I would like to know exactly what's going on...

How should we intervene is probably more my issue...I am definitely going to try to research what's the problem over there...

[upliftdisco365]

Originally posted by richierich:
What if anything should the U.S. do??? A lot of what goes on in Africa period is overlooked by the U.S....Rwanda, Congo, Zimbabwe, Sudan, Ethiopia, these places are going through a lot of turmoil and I was wondering .. does our government care?? Should they leave Africa alone or intervene? It hurts my own heart when I see the stuff going on over there.

Well, there's no oil on which to strike deals and the people who require assistance don't have any liquid capitol to hand over, so I s e r i o u s l y doubt that the US will be lending a democratic hand.

[jimmymack-2000]

Just out of interest, do you know the history of Liberia? It was actually created for the benefit of former slaves from the U.S. by admittedly misguided white liberals in 1821 (yes, they existed back then). The American Colonization Society, a predominantly white anti-slavery group, thought it would be better if African-Americans could be reunited with their "Motherland"...

[Koffy Brown]

I know right, I briefly heard them skip over this in the news and they made it loud and clear that it would be a precise agenda...in other words we ain't doing a whole lot...it's obvious that the reason why we haven't intervened any sooner is because their is nothing the US deems viable...it's sad...

[upliftdisco365]

Originally posted by jimmymack-2000:
Just out of interest, do you know the history of Liberia? It was actually created for the benefit of former slaves from the U.S. by admittedly misguided white liberals in 1821 (yes, they existed back then). The American Colonization Society, a predominantly white anti-slavery group, thought it would be better if African-Americans could be reunited with their "Motherland"...

Abraham Lincoln was an ACS advocate. His objective wasn't to necessarily free the slaves, he simply wanted an end to the North/South conflict, even if it meant sending the slaves back to Africa.

[mdpm99]

The "info" drifting thru the air is that if the US
gets involved then both sides are more than willing to put down their arms.

About 150 years ago, I believe, the US colonized that country. Also you have the British and the French involved in the two different bordering countries.

The Defense Dept. according to Dumsfield - opps! I mean Rummy, is that we are already to spread out. Would it make a difference if Oil was part of the equation?

Peace on Earth,

d

"oily to bed, oily to rise"

[Koffy Brown]

Major Events in Liberian History
Tue Jul 1, 6:08 PM ET

By The Associated Press

Key events in Liberian history beginning with independence in the 19th century:



_ 1847: Country gains independence; draws up U.S. type constitution.


_ 1926: Firestone Tire and Rubber Co. opens plantation; rubber becomes the


backbone of the economy.


_ 1943: William Tubman is elected president; promotes foreign investment and


local participation in government.


_ 1971: Tubman dies and William Tolbert Jr. succeeds him.


_ 1981: President William Tolbert Jr. is assassinated in a coup led by Master Sgt. Samuel Doe, who suspends the constitution.


_ 1984: Under pressure from the United States, Doe allows return of political parties.


_ 1985: Doe is elected president.


_ 1989: National Patriotic Front of Liberia, led by Charles Taylor, begins an uprising against the Doe government.


_ 1990: Doe is executed by an offshoot of Taylor's movement.


_ 1995: Economic Community of West African States brokers a peace treaty between two warring movements.


_ 1997: Taylor is elected president.


_ 1999: Britain and the United States threaten to suspend aid after Liberia is accused of supporting militants in neighboring Sierra Leone.


_ September 2000: Liberian forces launch offensive against rebels in the country's north.


_ March 2001: United Nations (news - web sites) imposes arms embargo to punish Taylor for trading weapons for diamonds from rebels in Sierra Leone.




_ November 2001: Government forces start new offensive against rebels.

_ January 2002: More than 50,000 Liberia and Sierra Leone refugees flee.

-2003

_ April: New rebel group, Movement for Democracy in Liberia, makes gains in southeast.

_ June 4: Taylor is indicted for war crimes committed during his involvement in Sierra Leone civil war.

_ June 6: Rebels clash with government forces outside Liberian capital Monrovia; refugee camps fall into rebel hands.

_ June 17: Taylor says he will step down under a cease-fire agreement.

_ June 20: Taylor renounces his peace pledge to cede power in Liberia, announcing he will serve to the January 2004 end of his term — and might run again.

_ June 23: The main rebel group in Liberia — Liberians United for Reconciliation and Democracy — says it's pulling out of peace talks.

_ June 27: Taylor's forces claimed to have driven rebels out of Liberia's capital after a four-day artillery battle that killed hundreds.

_ June 28: U.N. Secretary-General Kofi Annan (news - web sites) asks the Security Council for an international peace force for Liberia.

_ June 30: West African leaders ask for 2,000 American troops to head a predominantly African force to stop the turmoil and keep the peace.

_ July 1: Taylor turns down a secret deal to give him safe haven in Nigeria, senior U.N. diplomats say. Annan steps up pressure on Bush administration to take leading role.

[DJ76]

There's a 15 pages long indictment against the president Charles Taylor. The indictment was issued by the Special Court for Sierra Leone. It was unsealed on 4 June 2003, but for some reasoned was pulled back from the website.

I learned that after President Bush asked Taylor to step down, the latter made reference to the said indictment and affirmed he will not step down if there's a chance he's arrested and trasfered to the court.

I had the chance to end up getting a copy of the indictment. Taylor is accused of 17 counts of:

- terrorizing the civilian population and collective punishments

- unlawful killings

- sexual violence

- physical violence

- use of child soldiers

- abductions and forced labour

- looting and burning

- attacks on UN peacekeepers

Let's see what happens.

[richierich]

Yeah I did know that Liberia was a place for former slaves. But thewhole Africa thing puzzles me anyways.. Thw whole international community seems to kinda be lukewarm on getting things together over there. I know there have been relief efforts made by various agencies U.S. included but how come this continent seems to always be going thru turmoil and suffering. And then when I see pictures they all look like my cousins and stuff and I have actually cried especially when the Rwanda situation jumped off between the Hutu and Tutsi tribes.

[Koffy Brown]

Originally posted by richierich:
Yeah I did know that Liberia was a place for former slaves. But thewhole Africa thing puzzles me anyways.. Thw whole international community seems to kinda be lukewarm on getting things together over there. I know there have been relief efforts made by various agencies U.S. included but how come this continent seems to always be going thru turmoil and suffering. And then when I see pictures they all look like my cousins and stuff and I have actually cried especially when the Rwanda situation jumped off between the Hutu and Tutsi tribes.

The only way to begin to understand part of the turmoil that this country goes through is to know a little history about colonialization...Africa kind of remind me of Black people in America...actually it's very similar...outside influences, money, power, materialism, no spiritual connection, politics, assimilation, integration..etc...it is very saddening...

[Cheddar]

Funny, people request 9-11 documents and investigations into acts committed by this administration and things get sealed. But it is very easy to have the Bush termed "irrelevant" UN sanction someone else.
Just for the Record.

[mdpm99]

Ps.

IMO:

What irony! The absolute worst president in the history of the United States of America has the GALL to suggest another president resign!

opps! there I go again......

[img]graemlins/cool_shades.gif[/img]

d

[ July 03, 2003, 09:29 AM: Message edited by: david mancuso ]

[richierich]

If it's not AIDS it's hunger, famine, civil war, islam vs christianity all types of brutality and it just makes me sad.. why this continent??

[Koffy Brown]

Originally posted by richierich:
If it's not AIDS it's hunger, famine, civil war, islam vs christianity all types of brutality and it just makes me sad.. why this continent??

That is such a good question...why them? I kind of look at Africa as the center of the world...where it all began...and I believe it's where it all will end...kind of the alpha and omega...I just think we're struggling to get back what we've lost and what's been taken...traditions, culture etc...while at the same time improving life...but my personal opinion is that it won't be done by them alone...some how some way...We'll all have to unite at some point...kind of like a world movement sort of thing....

You ain't neva lied Mr. Mancuso...

[Koffy Brown]

Originally posted by richierich:
If it's not AIDS it's hunger, famine, civil war, islam vs christianity all types of brutality and it just makes me sad.. why this continent??

But also Richie, Blacks all over the world are basically suffering from these things...we're suffering in heaps and droves with AIDS here...also, religion I tell you...that is going to keep us seperated yet....

[richierich]

Originally posted by WhyYouNeedToKnow:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by richierich:
If it's not AIDS it's hunger, famine, civil war, islam vs christianity all types of brutality and it just makes me sad.. why this continent??

But also Richie, Blacks all over the world are basically suffering from these things...we're suffering in heaps and droves with AIDS here...also, religion I tell you...that is going to keep us seperated yet.... </font>[/QUOTE]Sad but true and it hurts.

[mdpm99]

Originally posted by richierich:
If it's not AIDS it's hunger, famine, civil war, islam vs christianity all types of brutality and it just makes me sad.. why this continent??

Greetings richierich:


How this country can just abandon Africa in the US foreign policy and news after what we did to her people is just obscene. Every day on the news we hear something about Israel and the Palestinians because both Arabs and Jews in the US have more political power than Africans. Israel and the Palestinians is nothing compared to the Congo, where 3 MILLION people have been killed in that war, or Liberia, or Sierra Leone before 2002. Not only that, in much of Southeastern Africa there's a famine right now, and most Americans don't know about it, and there seems no effort to get food from Europe or the US over there. What people don't know about African nations is that they are the fastest growing economy and fastest progressing societies on earth. If we were run by intelligent and non-racist leaders, we would be taking advantage of that opportunity by building up those countries economies. One thing about Africans-they love to work, they love to make money, and they will be the first ones to take advantage of an opportunity.

d

[DJ76]

they love to work? You've never been to Morocco! [img]graemlins/rofl.gif[/img]

[mdpm99]

Originally posted by DJ76:
they love to work? You've never been to Morocco! [img]graemlins/rofl.gif[/img]

As a matter of fact, I haven't....

d

[Koffy Brown]

For some reason I'm not remembering Liberia being founded by America, but I thought it was founded by Freed Slaves with an American type of Democracy...I could be wrong...I can't seem to find any history of Liberia on the net...will continue to research...

[DJ76]

Originally posted by david mancuso:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by DJ76:
they love to work? You've never been to Morocco! [img]graemlins/rofl.gif[/img]

As a matter of fact, I haven't....

d </font>[/QUOTE]I have [img]smile.gif[/img]
the last thing they wanna do is work.
WEEEEEEEEERRRRRRKKKKKKK!

[mdpm99]

Originally posted by WhyYouNeedToKnow:
For some reason I'm not remembering Liberia being founded by America, but I thought it was founded by Freed Slaves with an American type of Democracy...I could be wrong...I can't seem to find any history of Liberia on the net...will continue to research...

I think you got it right.....

Please let us know.

Thank you,

d

[Koffy Brown]

_ 1926: Firestone Tire and Rubber Co. opens plantation; rubber becomes the backbone of the economy.

There is something about this that make me think that the US has some type of interest in this country and government...other than...I guess it would be important to know exactly how disposable the US think these people are and would it be economical feasible to America in some fashion to intervene....

[mdpm99]

Originally posted by DJ76:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by david mancuso:

Originally posted by DJ76:
they love to work? You've never been to Morocco! [img]graemlins/rofl.gif[/img]

As a matter of fact, I haven't....

d </font>

I have [img]smile.gif[/img]
the last thing they wanna do is work.
WEEEEEEEEERRRRRRKKKKKKK! [/QUOTE

[img]graemlins/bolt.gif[/img]

d

[ July 03, 2003, 10:06 AM: Message edited by: david mancuso ]