Sell the Feeling, Not the Sex

[Myron]

Sex is part of the feeling.

[BrazenMuse]

Sex is part of the feeling.

Selah!

[DJ_Poet]

25 years ago, people were into deep house music and there was a lively movement. What happened was my generation failed the current one. We did not pass on the values we cherish and let the medias do it for us via tv, computers and phones. THIS is the reason why deep house music or anything that smacks of love, respect, communication, and understanding is ignored today.

True, there were people that saw the commercial potential of house music. However, there were plenty more people who saw the love in it.

[JMJ]

25 years ago, people were into deep house music and there was a lively movement. What happened was my generation failed the current one. We did not pass on the values we cherish and let the medias do it for us via tv, computers and phones. THIS is the reason why deep house music or anything that smacks of love, respect, communication, and understanding is ignored today.

No it's not......JMJ

[bkny11203]

I think everybody should like everybody.

[Myron]

I think everybody should like everybody.

No one is disliking anybody, they're just disagreeing with him. And in a civil manner as well.

[JMJ]

I think everybody should like everybody.

Everybody.....needs somebody.....JMJ

[bkny11203]

No one is disliking anybody, they're just disagreeing with him. And in a civil manner as well.

That is a Danny quoteable. Pay attenshun bruh. Watch a Danny vid...they are very informative.

[The Crazy Life That Is Alarick T]

Buy the sex, Sell the feeling.

[BrazenMuse]

Maybe it's just me, but in my zanz days, I went out to clubs that had atmosphere, that created that fantasy world for me. Given that this was the kind of environment I was going to, I dressed the part...we were all extras in each others' fantasies, dressed for the part and dancing like there would never be a tomorrow...
and, yeah, it was sexy. While you can't pay me to pick up club-straggs these days, I love going places where folks are dancing ...not for show, for camera, for video...but for themselves...if I dance alone in a corner all night, that's fine. And that is my feeling...if you watch me dance and think it's sexy, that's your feeling...if you feel like the energy of the place is more PLUR than Pick Up, then that's cool too...I don't see that separating the two is either possible or desireable...and I don't altogether think it's a matter of being jaded. There are parties I go to for that very thing...but there's still sexy in that if you have eyes to see...

[LadyA. Acacia]

Sex is part of the feeling.

Sex is part of the feeling.
Feeling is what what you do when you have sex.
Sex is part of the feeling and feels good.
Good is the type of sex i like.
Like is a button on Facebook.
Facebook is a site i am no longer on.
On the top is my position when having sex.
Sex is part of the feeling.

[JMJ]

Sex is part of the feeling.
Feeling is what what you do when you have sex.
Sex is part of the feeling and feels good.
Good is the type of sex i like.
Like is a button on Facebook.
Facebook is a site i am no longer on.
On the top is my position when having sex.
Sex is part of the feeling.

I played center field in college.....JMJ

[El Mayimbe]

That is a Danny quoteable. Pay attenshun bruh. Watch a Danny vid...they are very informative.

we all have, he posts the same threads in many dance music messageboards and were the ones here telling him that he gets an "A" for effort, esp since with his good nature, but information wise we're telling him he's not. its kind of naive


JMJ pointed out the PLUR phenomenon, you too should look into it

[Myron]

we all have, he posts the same threads in many dance music messageboards and were the ones here telling him that he gets an "A" for effort, esp since with his good nature, but information wise we're telling him he's not. its kind of naive

If he came off as a know-it-all like a lot of drive-by posters there would have been 15+ pages of "you don't know anything" posts with tons of insults, pictures, gifs, mimes, etc. by now. Maybe we should take the more "affable" approach with the more obnoxious drive-byers since it would probably make them disappear faster.

[El Mayimbe]

If he came off as a know-it-all like a lot of drive-by posters there would have been 15+ pages of "you don't know anything" posts with tons of insults, pictures, gifs, mimes, etc. by now. Maybe we should take the more "affable" approach with the more obnoxious drive-byers since it would probably make them disappear faster.

i would certainly take that approach had there been more of a constructive dialogue from OP but unfortunately its been "hey, house music is awesum! and see me dance to it" rather than lets talk about how we came to this point of what house music is all about in his billions of threads on the same topic




im not trying to kill the kids enthusiam which is great, but it reminds me of a younger silverbull with a sense of naivety to all things that house music comes off and not some world changing phenomenon as they hope for

[Armento]

woooork @ TAC

[Myron]

im not trying to kill the kids enthusiam which is great, but it reminds me of a younger silverbull with a sense of naivety to all things that house music comes off and not some world changing phenomenon as they hope for

Some people come into the scene with such naviety, heck sometimes I wish I still had that naviety but some have to go through such a phase to figure out whether it is for them. That's the way it goes with whatever interests people have.

[DaveR]

What you or I (older folk) remember as being great, is just a thing or an action to someone else today ... lots of wasted time yappin' about what 'a feeling' is - if one has to do that, one is likely completely out of the loop

Decades ago, I was excited to drive a car (at 16 years old) - mostly b/c it was a new experience ... nowadays, it's just a means to get from point A to point B

[El Mayimbe]

Some people come into the scene with such naviety, heck sometimes I wish I still had that naviety but some have to go through such a phase to figure out whether it is for them. That's the way it goes with whatever interests people have.

and thats great, no one is denying or against some new blood taking into heart this music but again, OP posts these videos & bolts out of the forum expecting us to engage in dialogue since he's making a claim that marketers are selling too much sex in house music. we the old jaded fuddy duddys want to explain to him that its more complicated than that and let him know there are many men of his age with better dancing abilities at the union square subway station making more money this way

if you follow his pattern it comes off more of a promotional tool rather than a serious discussion as to what house music is all about and through our debating were helping him achieve that goal

[DaveR]

... Decades ago, I was excited to drive a car (at 16 years old) - mostly b/c it was a new experience ... nowadays, it's just a means to get from point A to point B

[JMJ]

and thats great, no one is denying or against some new blood taking into heart this music but again, OP posts these videos & bolts out of the forum expecting us to engage in dialogue since he's making a claim that marketers are selling too much sex in house music. we the old jaded fuddy duddys want to explain to him that its more complicated than that and let him know there are many men of his age with better dancing abilities at the union square subway station making more money this way

if you follow his pattern it comes off more of a promotional tool rather than a serious discussion as to what house music is all about and through our debating were helping him achieve that goal

Yes, and let's be real. He's selling something (one look at his previous posts tells you that every post here was selling something), and this is another promotional tool thinly veiled as a topic for discussion......JMJ

[Myron]

Yes, and let's be real. He's selling something (one look at his previous posts tells you that every post here was selling something), and this is another promotional tool thinly veiled as a topic for discussion......JMJ

And people wonder why people look at someone's number of posts before responding.

[dannydance]

Ok first cool video Danny. Here is my take: I am not so sure that this would be an effective marketing tool. Even someone who would be attracted to your concept may not be drawn in for two reasons. There is only you dancing ( people need to get that "Oh I can/want to do that!" accomplish
ed more easily by more than one dancer), that track isn't quite a banger IMO (which would make people ask "where do I go to hear that?"). I also think you might want to edit out the point where you are just walking around. Anyone who is not already a dancer might not recognize it for what it is.

Thanks, DB. You bring up some good points, and if I ever have the funds to launch some kind of sustained marketing effort, I think you're right—having multiple dancers is important so people can connect with what they see. And the track is very underground, which I get. Thx for sharing your POV!

They lied, night-life has always been a combination of many things dance just being one, sex being another.
In fact one might argue that sex played an even bigger part in days gone by.

Try telling a teenager this is about a story or deep journey they will laugh and ask what the girls are like.
If you want to try and open up House to new people start a party and build something that people want to go too.

True; I just think the sexy side of the coin has been oversold (the David Guetta, Swedish House Mafia side of the culture) and it shows whenever you go to Ultra or even WMC. And I've held down a successful residency where people managed to come out for the music and the dancing, but it is very hard to market that, so I hear ya.

On another note, I've taught House Dance to little kids (middle schoolers to as young as 2nd graders) and the look on those kids faces when they danced to House Music was one of "this is so much fun!". I sometimes go out to the clubs to flirt and connect with people; but a lot of times I go out to dance and connect with music—I have the balance and I think it's important to teach/communicate that balance.

correct me if uim wrong but wasnt house music founded by gay black men?
of course sex has a big thing to do with this

asdf

Nothing to argue - the music, the dancing and the culture were all about sex when house music came about. Granted, that was almost 30 years ago, but it wasn't about "feeling" or PLUR or any of that other BS that house music clams to be about. It was dark, dirty, and raw (at least it was in my world), and somewhere along the way it got pussified.

As long as clubs and bar receipts are involved, "feeling" will continue to be a loser.

If you want "feeling" and dance to be the focal point, you've got to get that type of party OUT of a real club environment. It simply doesn't pay the bills.....JMJ

Pussified? House Music saved my life and I mean literally pulled me from the abyss. During that initial "discovery (of House Music) phase", I'd go out and buy drinks and flirt with the girls and all that, but what I remember most aren't the Johnny Walker Blacks and the fun escapades—it was the dance floor and how I felt on it. So all I'm saying is that while many people may share your view, I'm interested in also finding the many people out there that would potentially connect with the dancing and the feeling as much as I did.

Of course you are preaching to the choir and I totally get it. Unfortunately, the current generation was raised by the medias-at-large and are reluctant to have anything to do with a message of love, peace, respect, and understanding (even if there are copious amounts of sex thrown in).

I am of a mind that this music we share has already entered niche status and very few of the 20 somethings will find deep soulful house music interesting enough to get into it since the material world has them hook, line and sinker.

House Music was never about money, haters and conspicuous consumption.

Do you think it's all downhill (niche-wise) from here? I'm inclined to say that if there were resources large enough to communicate/market an alternative message (and I'm not necessarily talking about PLUR, but just a "dance is a feeling"-centric vibe), many people around the world would connect with the music differently than they do now. People, as you say, are influenced by what's marketed to them; put a vending machine in a school and of course a kid will like junk food—stick nothing but fruits and vegetables and what do you think they're gonna eat?

1. That message of love, peace, respect, and understanding? Didn't hold water 25 years ago much less now. Kids didn't buy into it then and they don't want to hear it today.

2. Your second statement about what House music was never about is a falsehood. While the music itself isn't about money, haters, etc., those elements have been there since the beginning.

I don't believe in unicorns either......JMJ

I hear ya. But I think the "this music is about the dancing first and foremost" is something that can connect with millions of people around the world, if only the culture tried to find them. I'm saying there are thousands of people like me in cities throughout the world, who don't even know it yet because they haven't been exposed to this side of the music. I'm not talking about unicorns, I'm talking about finding those people for whom the dancing is the primary focus and motivator for listening to House.

What kindda stupid sh8t is this? Re-read JMJ's post...

asdf

waggling the reproductive organs will lead the mind to sex.

and, frankly, I think that's cool. Everybody's sexy is different and house has room for that where certain other forms that are popular in clubs seem, to my eyes, to sell only one particular brand of sexy. One I don't much like. It's a strait jacket.
Nice vid!

Thanks for the compliment. I guess we could sell one brand of sexy (the feeling itself) just as hard as pop culture sells its brand of sexy (the lifestyle)—then we'd have a very interesting (and balanced!) dance floor indeed ;)

[bkny11203]

we all have, he posts the same threads in many dance music messageboards and were the ones here telling him that he gets an "A" for effort, esp since with his good nature, but information wise we're telling him he's not. its kind of naive


JMJ pointed out the PLUR phenomenon, you too should look into it

It's the sarcasms bruh....you should look in to it.

[dannydance]

25 years ago, people were into deep house music and there was a lively movement. What happened was my generation failed the current one. We did not pass on the values we cherish and let the medias do it for us via tv, computers and phones. THIS is the reason why deep house music or anything that smacks of love, respect, communication, and understanding is ignored today.

True, there were people that saw the commercial potential of house music. However, there were plenty more people who saw the love in it.

This is one of the more insightful points on here, and it's one my DJ and production mentors have made several times before; I think it scratches on the surface of truth. To be honest, I get frustrated sometimes that what you're saying seems to be the case, because I see Deep House (and by Deep I of course mean the various more underground flavors Deep, Soulful, French, Funky, etc) as having way more potential in terms of appeal than it does. I live in Miami, for example, and there isn't really a successful, widely attended weekly party of Deep House that I'm aware of. There are many talented and hardworking Deep House DJs here, of course, but in terms of traffic and consistency, the scene doesn't approach the level of engagement you get at a typical House party during WMC. Another metric is that the number of House Dancers in the whole area can barely be counted on two hands. So why is that? Because of what you said—that baton wasn't passed on from your generation to mine. I had to "stumble" upon that baton, and thank god I did because it revolutionized my life. But I always wonder how many—how MANY!—young people like me won't ever have the chance to discover this side of the culture simply because they aren't lucky enough to stumble upon it.

I just wish there were a more concerted effort to spread that message, which is part of why I do what I do and say what I say.

No one is disliking anybody, they're just disagreeing with him. And in a civil manner as well.

Very true, and I appreciate that, by the way.

Maybe it's just me, but in my zanz days, I went out to clubs that had atmosphere, that created that fantasy world for me. Given that this was the kind of environment I was going to, I dressed the part...we were all extras in each others' fantasies, dressed for the part and dancing like there would never be a tomorrow...
and, yeah, it was sexy. While you can't pay me to pick up club-straggs these days, I love going places where folks are dancing ...not for show, for camera, for video...but for themselves...if I dance alone in a corner all night, that's fine. And that is my feeling...if you watch me dance and think it's sexy, that's your feeling...if you feel like the energy of the place is more PLUR than Pick Up, then that's cool too...I don't see that separating the two is either possible or desireable...and I don't altogether think it's a matter of being jaded. There are parties I go to for that very thing...but there's still sexy in that if you have eyes to see...

Whole-heartedly agree with that because it reflects the reality—PLUR + Pick Up, as you put it—though I'm arguing that the dance side of things has the potential to connect with and tap into a part of the market that currently isn't plugged into House. To connect with that pool of people (people like me, driven mainly by the feeling of the music), you need to segment the message, separating the contents a bit. In my opinion. When I found House, it wasn't "Oh, look at this really sexy thing that happens to have amazing music as the backdrop"...it was more like, "Look at this really amazing music culture with this funky new way of dancing...oh, and look at all these sexy people too". But I found that second part out as a function of the first ;)

we all have, he posts the same threads in many dance music messageboards and were the ones here telling him that he gets an "A" for effort, esp since with his good nature, but information wise we're telling him he's not. its kind of naive


JMJ pointed out the PLUR phenomenon, you too should look into it

I do indeed post these vids and my music to many message boards, as one of the ways I try to get my message out...and call me naive if you'd like; I guess maybe there's room for different points of view on what constitutes the culture and what valid interpretations of it are. I choose to interpret the culture—for me—as something to be danced to first, romanced to second.

i would certainly take that approach had there been more of a constructive dialogue from OP but unfortunately its been "hey, house music is awesum! and see me dance to it" rather than lets talk about how we came to this point of what house music is all about in his billions of threads on the same topic




im not trying to kill the kids enthusiam which is great, but it reminds me of a younger silverbull with a sense of naivety to all things that house music comes off and not some world changing phenomenon as they hope for

We're having the dialogue now; this thread and this conversation is in part a result of those "billions" of posts. Frankly, I wish I could work full-time just learning about, absorbing, and otherwise integrating House Music and its history into every thread of my life, but I work two jobs to support my passion until my passion can support me. I spend every other waking minute making music, making and posting videos, and spreading my interpretation of the culture, and call that interpretation wrong if you disagree with it, but I'm proud of it.

I wish your generation had done a better job of conveying this message to my generation; maybe today there wouldn't be such a lopsided conversation taking place between the folks who claim the message was never about love, hope or feeling and the folks who think House Music can and should be better.

and thats great, no one is denying or against some new blood taking into heart this music but again, OP posts these videos & bolts out of the forum expecting us to engage in dialogue since he's making a claim that marketers are selling too much sex in house music. we the old jaded fuddy duddys want to explain to him that its more complicated than that and let him know there are many men of his age with better dancing abilities at the union square subway station making more money this way

if you follow his pattern it comes off more of a promotional tool rather than a serious discussion as to what house music is all about and through our debating were helping him achieve that goal

I make no apologies for my posts...I do what I can given the natural time constraints of being one person with 24 hours in a day. I've carved out the last hour responding to as many of the substantive posts in this thread as possible because I recognize that it has to be a two-way conversation.

I know this thing is more complicated than that; it's easy for you guys to sit across the computer screen and call my perspective naive; frankly, I also realize that distilling the message into "this culture is about passion/feeling/dancing" is an oversimplification of a larger point in a culture that's way bigger than me and has a history longer than my own lifespan. However, I also think that creating the change I wish to see involves being the change I wish to see—and I put a lot of effort into being that in the hopes that—yes, of course, partially in the hopes that I'll be successful and be able to make a living doing what I love (making music, dancing, DJing, etc)—but also in the hopes that some kid off in some city where there's not a big House culture community might stumble across my message and say, "You know what? I dig that. Let me try to expand on that and build something here." Because that's exactly what happened to me.

Lastly, I'll say that just because I promote myself and my music extensively doesn't mean that I don't believe in what I'm saying or in the message behind what I'm saying. My output speaks for itself; I'm chasing a dream and of course I want to reach my goals, and there's nothing wrong with that.

Thanks for the dialogue...house music all night long.