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Thread: A Joyful day for the religious right…Women beware.

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    Senate Expected to Approve Ban on Abortion Procedure Today
    By DAVID STOUT

    Published: October 21, 2003


    ASHINGTON, Oct. 21 — Debate was under way in the Senate today on a bill to ban a procedure that has stirred deep emotions in the long struggle over abortion.

    The Senate was expected to pass the ban on the procedure, described by abortion foes as "partial birth abortion," before the end of business today. With House passage of the bill three weeks ago, the Senate's expected action today will send the bill to President Bush, who is eager to sign it.

    With Mr. Bush's signature, the bill will become — on paper, if not in effect — the first federal ban on a specific abortion method since a woman's constitutional right to have an abortion was established in 1973 by the Supreme Court's Roe v. Wade decision.

    "We believe that this bill is constitutionally sound and obviously very, very necessary in terms of who we are as a society," said Senator Rick Santorum, the Pennsylvania Republican who is the bill's chief sponsor and one of the Senate's most outspoken opponents of abortion.

    Senator Barbara Boxer, Democrat of California, expressed an opposite view. Anticipating the Senate vote, she said the legislation "for the first time in history bans a medical procedure without making any exception for the health of the woman." She predicted that it was "clearly going to be declared unconstitutional."

    The law moving through the Senate today would make it a crime for doctors to perform what is known in the medical profession as "intact dilation and extraction," a procedure occasionally used in the second and third trimesters. Opponents of the law have expressed fears that its language is broad enough to cover other procedures as well.

    President Bill Clinton twice vetoed bans on the procedure because they did not include exceptions to protect the health of the woman. But with Republicans now in control of both houses of Congress, as well as the White House, the legislation was bound to come up again.

    The House passed the bill by 281 to 142 on Oct. 3. A similarly wide margin is expected in the Senate.

    The legislation faces formidable hurdles in the courts, where opponents of the bill have vowed to challenge it.

    On June 28, 2000, the Supreme Court ruled, in overturning a Nebraska law, that the government could not prohibit doctors from using the procedure, because it might be the most medically appropriate way of terminating some pregnancies. The justices also declared the Nebraska law faulty because it did not contain an exception to protect the health of the woman.

    That ruling upheld a lower federal court in striking down the Nebraska law and by extension the laws of some 30 other states. The vote was 5 to 4, narrow enough to make abortion-rights proponents nervous. But the lineup of justices has not changed, so there is no reason to think the court's underlying support for the right to abortion has changed either.

    But there is every reason to think the fight over "partial-birth abortion," which is not a recognized medical term, will go on, like the debate over abortion in general.

    The coming election year will surely intensify the debate. So will the inevitable vacancies on the Supreme Court, as politicians study the court nominees' records and comments on abortion.

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    Topics on how to masturbate and the likes gets almost 4-5 ****ing pages, and a topic that will affect each and everyone of us someday, goes unnotice.....no wonder these zealots are stripping us of our rights everyday...actually, they are blatantly taking them as we stand by with our eyes wide open....

    I guess if it is not a topic on birthday, flirting, f'ing or some other nonsense, it makes for a boring day on the DHP...WAKE UP, PEOPLE...IT WON'T BE LONG FOR THESE RELIGIOUS RIGHT WINGERS TO MAKE ABORTION ILLEGAL AGAIN AND YOUR NIECE AND DAUGHTERS WILL BE THE ONES WITH A WIRE HANGER IN THAT ALLEYWAY....DEJA VU IS A MUTHERFVCKER!!!

    ...things like this is why I'm trying to win the battle of the DHP addiction....this will make it easier...

    [img]mad1.gif[/img]

    [ October 21, 2003, 01:46 PM: Message edited by: liL Ray ]
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    word

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    This is only one more step toward murder convictions of unborn babies. If this law is pass then law makers can pass stricter laws on murder of unborn babies. There have been many cases in many states people have killed a woman and her unborn child or just killing the unborn child and got a sentence of neglect or assualt. So if the partial abortions are illegal it will make it harder for the lawyers to fight a 1st degree or manslaughter charge.

    This is very interesting I can't wait to see the responses. Personally having 2nd or 3rd trimester abortions is wrong, the fetus is very formed and has movement. Some women have these abortions because of retardation or abnormalties of the baby. I've met a girl that had one after her boyfriend left, she had the pregnancy terminated at 7 months. [img]graemlins/stupid.gif[/img]
    "I am an innovator, a visionary and set apart from the rest! I am an Eagle and Eagles don't travel in groups! A.H. Hughes

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    Originally posted by liL Ray:
    Topics on how to masturbate and the likes gets almost 4-5 ****ing pages, and a topic that will affect each and everyone of us someday, goes unnotice.....no wonder these zealots are stripping us of our rights everyday...actually, they are blatantly taking them as we stand by with our eyes wide open....

    I guess if it is not a topic on birthday, flirting, f'ing or some other nonsense, it makes for a boring day on the DHP...WAKE UP, PEOPLE...IT WON'T BE LONG FOR THESE RELIGIOUS RIGHT WINGERS TO MAKE ABORTION ILLEGAL AGAIN AND YOUR NIECE AND DAUGHTERS WILL BE THE ONES WITH A WIRE HANGER IN THAT ALLEYWAY....DEJA VU IS A MUTHERFVCKER!!!

    ...things like this is why I'm trying to win the battle of the DHP addiction....this will make it easier...

    [img]mad1.gif[/img]
    Just because people don't reply to a post doesn't mean is not getting read...

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    Thats house!

    Fundamentally these people hate women, whether they be men or women themselves. They have no regard or no concern for you metaphysically except to be a breeder and to sacrifice your life to some idea of ‘child’, more than likely ‘boy’.

    Just remember, the rich, will always be able to get their abortion.

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    Just read this, what in the hell is really going on in the States? Rights being stripped away, what will be next, gun control? no voting for women? Segregation?

    I don't get it, What is really going on down there? :( I don't necessarily want to believe in all those conspiracy theories but damn, a lot of them seem to be happening :(
    I am ready to meet my Maker. Whether my Maker is prepared for the great ordeal of meeting me is another matter. ~ Winston Churchill

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    Originally posted by DiscoLady:
    Personally having 2nd or 3rd trimester abortions is wrong
    Not when the birth puts the mothers health at risk!

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    Originally posted by MYOR:
    </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by liL Ray:
    Topics on how to masturbate and the likes gets almost 4-5 ****ing pages, and a topic that will affect each and everyone of us someday, goes unnotice.....no wonder these zealots are stripping us of our rights everyday...actually, they are blatantly taking them as we stand by with our eyes wide open....

    I guess if it is not a topic on birthday, flirting, f'ing or some other nonsense, it makes for a boring day on the DHP...WAKE UP, PEOPLE...IT WON'T BE LONG FOR THESE RELIGIOUS RIGHT WINGERS TO MAKE ABORTION ILLEGAL AGAIN AND YOUR NIECE AND DAUGHTERS WILL BE THE ONES WITH A WIRE HANGER IN THAT ALLEYWAY....DEJA VU IS A MUTHERFVCKER!!!

    ...things like this is why I'm trying to win the battle of the DHP addiction....this will make it easier...

    [img]mad1.gif[/img]
    Just because people don't reply to a post doesn't mean is not getting read... </font>[/QUOTE]That was weak....I usually expect more vim and vigor from your replies, so when you come with a weak reply like that to defend the weak minds, I have to check yah....and that was not a diss to you....
    I Am Almost Keeping It Real

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    I also see the racial aspects of this. I think many are not happy about how brown this country is getting...read your census figures people.

    Ray I hear ya!
    It ain't how much you know, it's what you do with what you do know!

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    Originally posted by liL Ray:
    </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by MYOR:
    </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by liL Ray:
    Topics on how to masturbate and the likes gets almost 4-5 ****ing pages, and a topic that will affect each and everyone of us someday, goes unnotice.....no wonder these zealots are stripping us of our rights everyday...actually, they are blatantly taking them as we stand by with our eyes wide open....

    I guess if it is not a topic on birthday, flirting, f'ing or some other nonsense, it makes for a boring day on the DHP...WAKE UP, PEOPLE...IT WON'T BE LONG FOR THESE RELIGIOUS RIGHT WINGERS TO MAKE ABORTION ILLEGAL AGAIN AND YOUR NIECE AND DAUGHTERS WILL BE THE ONES WITH A WIRE HANGER IN THAT ALLEYWAY....DEJA VU IS A MUTHERFVCKER!!!

    ...things like this is why I'm trying to win the battle of the DHP addiction....this will make it easier...

    [img]mad1.gif[/img]
    Just because people don't reply to a post doesn't mean is not getting read... </font>[/QUOTE]That was weak....I usually expect more vim and vigor from your replies, so when you come with a weak reply like that to defend the weak minds, I have to check yah....and that was not a diss to you.... </font>[/QUOTE]Whats weak about it? The IMPORTANT thing is that people are reading it.. Not taking it as a diss ;)

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    Originally posted by Jamie Lennox:
    </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by DiscoLady:
    Personally having 2nd or 3rd trimester abortions is wrong
    Not when the birth puts the mothers health at risk! </font>[/QUOTE]You are right that is why I stated what this girl I know that did it was wrong. It's wrong when you are being selfish or doing it out of spite.
    "I am an innovator, a visionary and set apart from the rest! I am an Eagle and Eagles don't travel in groups! A.H. Hughes

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    Originally posted by MYOR:
    </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by liL Ray:
    Topics on how to masturbate and the likes gets almost 4-5 ****ing pages, and a topic that will affect each and everyone of us someday, goes unnotice.....no wonder these zealots are stripping us of our rights everyday...actually, they are blatantly taking them as we stand by with our eyes wide open....

    I guess if it is not a topic on birthday, flirting, f'ing or some other nonsense, it makes for a boring day on the DHP...WAKE UP, PEOPLE...IT WON'T BE LONG FOR THESE RELIGIOUS RIGHT WINGERS TO MAKE ABORTION ILLEGAL AGAIN AND YOUR NIECE AND DAUGHTERS WILL BE THE ONES WITH A WIRE HANGER IN THAT ALLEYWAY....DEJA VU IS A MUTHERFVCKER!!!

    ...things like this is why I'm trying to win the battle of the DHP addiction....this will make it easier...

    [img]mad1.gif[/img]
    Just because people don't reply to a post doesn't mean is not getting read... </font>[/QUOTE]'zactly MYOR. okay i'll respond,

    "this is an outrage! i will write my senators and urge them not to support this legislation, which i feel to be a vicious preliminary assault on women and on the poor, under the guise of moral veracity!" [img]graemlins/cussing.gif[/img]

    and i really mean that. [img]smile.gif[/img]

    [ October 21, 2003, 02:00 PM: Message edited by: THX-1138 ]
    ...

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    Originally posted by DiscoLady:

    This is very interesting I can't wait to see the responses. Personally having 2nd or 3rd trimester abortions is wrong, the fetus is very formed and has movement. Some women have these abortions because of retardation or abnormalties of the baby. I've met a girl that had one after her boyfriend left, she had the pregnancy terminated at 7 months. [img]graemlins/stupid.gif[/img]
    [img]graemlins/nono.gif[/img] Abortion at 7months..

    I am Pro-Choice but damn that's just not right

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    "Debate was under way in the Senate today on a bill to ban a procedure that has stirred deep emotions in the long struggle over abortion.

    The Senate was expected to pass the ban on the procedure, described by abortion foes as "partial birth abortion," before the end of business today."
    It ain't how much you know, it's what you do with what you do know!

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    Originally posted by DiscoLady:
    Personally having 2nd or 3rd trimester abortions is wrong, the fetus is very formed and has movement. Some women have these abortions because of retardation or abnormalties of the baby. I've met a girl that had one after her boyfriend left, she had the pregnancy terminated at 7 months. [img]graemlins/stupid.gif[/img]
    Who are we to judge??

    What gets me is, folks balk at these(or all) abortions, and force these folks to have the child, but when the child is born, where are these same right wing zealots to give a helping hand...oh, let me answer that, they are back in Congress passing laws to limit welfare to single mothers, cutting states budget, which then have to cut programs that administer care to retarded children, daycare program(it's a travesty what is going on in NYc daycare).....and good forbid you decide to leave your kid on a neighbors stoop because you listen to these right to lifers and now you can't take care of the child.....aaaaarrrrgggghhhh....should I go on, or you get the picture?

    .....and these same ****ers are the first to vote for the death penalty....I guess the old addage of "I brought you into this world, and I'll take you out" applies here on a much higher level....

    [img]mad1.gif[/img]
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    I must note however, that because some women do use this as a form of birth control, it has given ample ammunition for these people to use against us. There is a deeper issue at hand here and the less we take responsibilty for our own actions the more "they" will take it for us. jmo.
    I am ready to meet my Maker. Whether my Maker is prepared for the great ordeal of meeting me is another matter. ~ Winston Churchill

    Out of suffering have emerged the strongest souls. The most massive characters are seared with scars. ~ Khalil Gibran

    men ARE the new women...hee hee

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    Originally posted by Jamie Lennox:
    Thats house!


    Just remember, the rich, will always be able to get their abortion.
    That is the most truth I have heard all day...

    I do not think it is about the rights of children as much as it is about keeping one sector of society breeding.
    (\\_/)There are two paths you can <br />(O.o)go by, but in the long run, <br />(&gt; &lt;)there\'s still time to change the road you\'re on.-Led Zep- <br /><a href=\"http://www.clubradio.net/music/mixshowcomments.cfm?id=6310\" target=\"_blank\">Blue Sol Nov</a>

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    [quote]Originally posted by THX-1138:
    "this is an outrage! i will write my senators and urge them not to support this legislation, which i feel to be a vicious preliminary assault on women and on the poor, under the guise of moral veracity!" [img]graemlins/cussing.gif[/img]

    and i really mean that. [img]smile.gif[/img]
    This is the problem(and the reason why the right wingers will continue to win) with most of us in this great country...we REACT, we don't ACT....read again, this is a done deal....the best you can do is fight it in court and hope it gets to the Supreme court and they overturn it.....now you see why folks were in the streets yelling not to vote for Bush...now you see why voting for your local judges is important....and now do you see why Bush has been pushing to get a conservative(like that fvckface from Honduras....no diss to Hondurian, my wife is from that country) judge in the Applette Court(???, lawyers correct me here), and eventually the Supreme Court.....???? HELLO!!!!

    Bigups Lennox....no matter what they say about you, you dah man!!!
    I Am Almost Keeping It Real

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    Originally posted by Leslie:
    I also see the racial aspects of this. I think many are not happy about how brown this country is getting...read your census figures people.
    If you're implying what I think you're implying, wouldn't that mean more support for and easier access to abortion?
    "Tattooed men who are not behind bars are either latent criminals or degenerate aristocrats. If someone who is tattooed dies in freedom, then he does so a few years before he would have committed murder." -- Adolf Loos

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    this is why we were and still against arnold in california

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    Originally posted by gf:
    the less we take responsibilty for our own actions the more "they" will take it for us. jmo.
    This is the argument they, the religious freaks, rely on to come from us....now we are fighting their battles also....

    [ October 21, 2003, 02:16 PM: Message edited by: liL Ray ]
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    Originally posted by liL Ray:
    </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by THX-1138:
    "this is an outrage! i will write my senators and urge them not to support this legislation, which i feel to be a vicious preliminary assault on women and on the poor, under the guise of moral veracity!" [img]graemlins/cussing.gif[/img]

    and i really mean that. [img]smile.gif[/img]
    This is the problem(and the reason why the right wingers will continue to win) with most of us in this great country...we REACT, we don't ACT....read again, this is a done deal....the best you can do is fight it in court and hope it gets to the Supreme court and they overturn it.....now you see why folks were in the streets yelling not to vote for Bush...now you see why voting for your local judges is important....and now do you see why Bush has been pushing to get a conservative(like that fvckface from Honduras....no diss to Hondurian, my wife is from that country) judge in the Applette Court(???, lawyers correct me here), and eventually the Supreme Court.....???? HELLO!!!!

    Bigups Lennox....no matter what they say about you, you dah man!!!
    </font>
    It's not a done deal because it hasn't been approved by the senate. It's only expected to find approval there. That's what I read. And in defense of myself, I petitioned both nationally and locally back in March in Illinois to demonstrate to my Congressmen that I was not in support of this leg. when I first got a whiff of it.

    DHP participation is not a barometer of how people feel and act in real life, Ray.
    ...

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    Here are some statistics you should know about abortion:

    CRS Report for Congress


    Abortion Prevalence

    The latest statistics on abortions published by the federal Centers for Disease Control
    and Prevention (CDC) indicate that a total of 1,267,415 legally induced abortions were
    performed in 1994. The 1994 CDC number represents a 4.7% decrease from the 7
    1,330,414 abortions reported for 1993. The women who had abortions in 1994 were more
    likely to be young (53.7% were 24 years old or younger), white (60.5%), and unmarried
    (80.1%). Many of the more than one million women had no prior live births 46.2%, or
    585,546. Most of the abortions were performed in the first trimester of pregnancy (12
    weeks or less gestation). A total of 680,602, or 53.7%, were performed at or before the 8
    eighth week of gestation and 88.1% (1,116,592) before the thirteenth week, while 1.3%,
    or 16,476, were induced at 21 weeks or later, in late second trimester and the third
    trimester. The abortion procedure used most frequently, for 99.1% of the abortions, was
    curettage (suction and sharp curettage; curettage means scraping of the interior of the
    uterus.). The intrauterine instillation method was used in fewer than 1% of abortions;
    0.5% (6,337). A total of 0.4%, or 5,070, were performed using other procedures,
    including hysterotomy and hysterectomy. No data was reported by CDC on the partialbirth
    abortion, or intact dilation and extraction, method.

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    Originally posted by jimmymack-2000:
    </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Leslie:
    I also see the racial aspects of this. I think many are not happy about how brown this country is getting...read your census figures people.
    If you're implying what I think you're implying, wouldn't that mean more support for and easier access to abortion? </font>[/QUOTE]Not necessarily - look at the opposite of it. Looks who's more likely to abort an unwanted pregnancy as oppossed to who is more likely to keep an unplanned pregnancy.
    It ain't how much you know, it's what you do with what you do know!

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